CLOWN MASSES WITH FULL, CONSCIOUS AND ACTIVE PARTICIPATION BUT NO REVERENCE AND UNLIKE ACTUAL CLOWN OR PUPPET MASSES, THESE EXIST IN ABUNDANCE IN HIGH PLACES…
Watch below the brief facebook video from a recent episcopal ordination at St. Patrick’s, there is no hint of the sacred in the processional. Even Pope Francis would be aghast at it and the celebrity status of those to be ordained and the other bishops and the people in the pew seem to be groupies not the Faithful who know why they have gathered for Mass. This is a coronation and a spectacle but with no dignity or majesty! It is a sham and it is the cult of the personality and for the Cardinal Archbishop to be blowing kisses in the procession is unseemly.
But and this is the big but…That congregation loves it. They want this and the clergy, bishops and cardinals know it and they know how to play to their fans and fans these people are.
It’s the ethos of the post Vatican II reforms that allows for this and actually encourages it. And yes, that’s the problem!
13 comments:
"It's the ethos of the Post Vatican II reforms..."
STOP IT! ENOUGH!
1). REFORM is defined as as a verb or a noun. As a noun (as used in the quote) it means: "amendment of what is defective, vicious, corrupt, or depraved; removal or correction of errors or of an abuse or a wrong."
Does anyone here DARE to tell us that the TLM as practiced before and during the Council was "defective", "vicious" or "corrupt"? Was it in "error"?
2). Vatican II WAS NOT A REFORM COUNCIL. TRENT WAS. Vatican II was a "pastoral" council and anyone with an IQ higher than a fly who has read Sacrosanctum Concilium knows darned well that this Mass Paul VI gave us IS NOT what was called for in the document.
There are no "Vatican II Reforms". Just to utter such a disingenuous lie stinks. Are we going to just mindlessly keep towing the party line or are we going to start telling the truth?
"Reforms" my foot!
The reform of the Mass was pastoral to enable lay participation in the spoken and sung way, to be more engaged in the Mass and to encourage the laity to pray the Mass and not devotions during it, such as the Rosary or zoning out with one's own mediation or day dreaming or simply to fulfill an obligation.
I would say the reforms went too far and we still haven't seen the actual participation the council sought on a pastoral level and many Catholics, if you look at them during the Ordinary Form Mass, look as though they would prefer to be anywhere else but there, they are like the walking dead!
What to do, what to do, oh what are we to do?
Suppress the OF and start over. It is obvious it is not doing the job when only about 30 percent of attendees believe in the Real Presence. But this inconvenient fact is ignored by the hierarchy. They are being obtuse or contumacious or both.
I don't have any answers about what to do.
But the "reformed" Mass was NOT reformed by Vatican II. It is a MATTER OF HISTORICAL RECORD that this "reform" was imposed upon us by a pope and it was concocted by a committee that included SIX PROTESTANTS. Protestants are GREAT at "reforming" things--they start a new "reform" every time they don't like a doctrine or a pastor. But they are utterly unqualified to reform the Catholic Church and, again, the Second Vatican Council wasn't about "reform" anyway. And the leader of the august group, Bugnini--his record speaks for itself.
This has flawed, lacking proper authority and wrong written all over it, but we move ahead with it anyway and just accept it like good little mindless people.
Trent reformed the Church. Vatican II reformed the way modern Catholics think--or should I say, laid the groundwork to make sure that we stop thinking all together and just do what we're told.
excuse me, ALTOGETHER
Thomas Garrett,
The only good news is that Pope Francis has now set down a precedent for a more traditionally minded Pope to suppress the OF.
It still baffles me that so many of the hierarchy just sat back and allowed this to unfold. In 1962, the beginning of the Council, the Church, at least in the US, was at the height of its prestige, influence, and doing much good through its schools, hospitals, and charities. It is now a rump of its 1962 self yet the bishops do nothing except concoct new nonsense, Synod anyone?, unless of course if you are a GASP traditional Catholic, then begone!
Sadly, the "Six Protestant Ministers" myth lives on...
OH! But there's a picture that SHOWS them with Pope Paul VI! Yes, there is a picture that shows them with Paul VI. That's it. Nothing more. They were there. There is a picture of them there.
Yes, and there were Protestant observers are Vatican One, too.
OH! But there are any number of claims made by some number of authors that this is TRUE!
Yes, and there are claims made that JFK, Jimmy Hoffa, and ELvis are living together in an island near Aruba.
OH! But Bignini said, "We must strip from our Catholic prayers and from the Catholic liturgy everything which can be the shadow of a stumbling block for our separated brethren that is for the Protestants."
No, he didn't. He said, ""L'orazione 7° reca il titolo; 'Per l'unità del cristiani' (non 'della Chiesa', che è sta stata sempre una). Non si paria più di 'eretici' e 'scismatici', ma di 'tutti i fratelli che credondo in Cristo'...
Gli studiosi penseranno e mettere in luce le fonti bibliche e liturgiche da cui derivano o alle quali si inspirano i nuovi testi, elaborati col cesello dai Gruppi di studio del 'Consilium' E diacomo pure che non di rado lavore è proceduto 'cum timore et tremore' nel dover sacrificare espressioni e concetti tantocari, e ormai per lunga consuetudine familiari. Come non rimpiangere per esempio 'ad sanctam matrem Ecclesiam catolicam atque apostolicam revocare dignetur' della settima orazione? E tuttavia l'amore delle anime e il desiderio di agevolare in ogni modo il cammino dell'unione ai fratelli separati, rimovendo ogni pietra che possa constituire pur lontanamente un inciampo o motivo di disagio, hanno indoto la Chiesa anche a quiesti penosi sacrifici."
The portion in question is: "And yet it is the love of souls and the desire to help in any way the road to union of the separated brethren, by removing every stone that could even remotely constitute an obstacle or difficulty, that has driven the Church to make even these painful sacrifices."
Don't believe me? Read the March 19, 1965 edition of L'Osservatore Romano.
Sadly the myth of being a catholic priest for those who votes for the party of intrinsic evil lives on, which party is complicit in more murders than those committed by Adolph Hitler. The party of Non Serviam!
In the end, the "myths" cited by the priest in his reply all come down to credibility of sources and who one might believe, implicitly suggesting that L'Osservatore Romano is unassailable.
Even IF every claim made in that reply is true, (big "if") there is one "myth" that won't go away...that the Mass we get every Sunday from the Novus Ordo regime is the Mass called for by Vatican II (specifically, Sacrosanctum Concilium). As I said before, anyone can read the document and see that what we've got is NOT what was called for.
But no....no, no! We will just keep chanting the mantra of "reform" that we've pulled out of the hat AFTER this "pastoral" Council. We'll just keep accepting the work of this committee as "knowing what's best for us"--never mind that anyone with a fourth grade reading ability can tell that it is clearly NOT what was called for.
And, given current conditions we can also see that this "wonderful" pastoral Council is coming back to bite us all in the _ss. Not only did John XXIII ignore our Lady's call to reveal the Third Secret of Fatima, but DELIBERATELY did the most UN-PASTORAL thing possible in the world at that time--arranged the Metz Agreement (I'm sure any expert reading this can dismiss THAT as a "myth" too) guaranteeing no condemnations of Communism at the Council--all in the name of assuring the presence of Russian Orthodox "observers". Imagine! A "pastoral" Council that deliberately avoids confronting the most devastating problem facing the world in its time--a problem responsible for more innocent deaths than any other social ill--and it goes forward anyway.
So help me the more one reads the histories of Vatican II and reflects on its purported glories and "gifts" and compares them to reality, the more sickening the phoniness and sham becomes. I better stop--I can feel my anger rising with each word I type.
Thomas Garrett,
Here is support for your position:
Returning to the “myth” that Protestant observers did not contribute in creating the New Mass, to hold this position is to deny the obvious – not only in fact, but also in substance. In the first place, an ecumenical liturgy that would no longer offend Protestants was Fr. Annibale Bugnini’s intention from the get-go as he declared in 1965:
We must strip from our Catholic prayers and from the Catholic liturgy everything which can be the shadow of a stumbling block for our separated brethren that is for the Protestants… [my emphasis]
While we learn from the close confidant of Pope Paul VI, Jean Guitton:
The intention of Pope Paul VI with regard to what is commonly called the Mass, was to reform the Catholic Liturgy in such a way that it should almost coincide with the Protestant liturgy. There was with Pope Paul VI an ecumenical intention to remove, or, at least to correct, or, at least to relax, what was too Catholic in the traditional sense in the Mass and, I repeat, to get the Catholic Mass closer to the Calvinist mass” [my emphasis][4].
To accomplish this ecumenical goal, the Consilium enlisted the help of these Protestant observers:
1. A. Raymond George (Methodist)
2. Ronald Jaspar (Anglican)
3. Massey Shepherd (Episcopalian)
4. Friedrich Künneth (Lutheran)
5. Eugene Brand (Lutheran)[5]
6. Max Thurian (Calvinist-community of Taize).
Their contribution in creating the New Mass was immortalized in a picture taken of them during an audience with Pope Paul VI after thanking them for their assistance. The image was subsequently published in L’Osservatore Romano on April 23, 1970 with the title: “Commission Holds Final Meeting, Pope Commends Work of Consilium”.
In addition to the self-evidence of this photograph, we also have verifying testimony from several persons, the most well-known being the aforementioned Anglican Jaspar, who described to Michael Davies how the Protestant contributors gave their input, often implemented verbatim.
But let’s pretend this picture does not exist, nor any credible testimonies from Protestants who were actually there. Even without these we still have more than sufficient evidence of Proof Protestant in the Pudding: in the texts of the Novus Ordo Missae itself."
TJM,
Couldn't help but notice that not one of those Protestants you named was a Universalist.
Then again, who needs a Universalist in the Consilium, when we have one sitting on the Chair of Peter?
Notice Father “Myth” clammed up?
TJM:
I think we're better off attacking ideas and not those who embrace them. No one was ever persuaded by being mocked, ridiculed or belittled. I ought to know--those are three of my favorite sports.
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