Wednesday, November 8, 2023



The Episcopalians know this. The Lutherans know this. The Methodists know this. The Presbyterians know this. Liberalism (Modernism) is the death knell of Churches and religions. The current Vatican’s highest position seems to be clueless:

Study: Liberal US priests facing ‘progressive’ extinction


Tom Makin said...

As the great Lee Corso would say "Not so fast". This group of "Priests" still wield tremendous power and influence as exhibited by the Sillynod. They are not going quietly or quickly. I have a 92 year old Aunt who, as a prominent lay person, was heavily involved in her diocese implementing and "interpreting" the spirit of VCII back in the day. She traveled around to various churches guiding, cajoling, and arm twisting the Council's direction. To this day, in her assisted living apartment she is saying "we didn't go far enough....women priests, gay blessings, lay conclave name it. Bottom line: "Not so fast"

Mark Thomas said...

The following section of the report has corresponded to my interactions with younger priests:

-- Accountability to the Pope

"This significant shift toward a more conservative presbyterate has been seen in other studies. In the context of the current pontificate (Pope Francis is often seen as more liberal or progressive than his immediate predecessors) the question arises whether there are discernable signs of tension between younger, more conservative priests and the pope."

"We asked survey participants whether they value their accountability to various people or parties: “God,” “Pope Francis,” “my bishop,” “my brother priests,” “my parishioners,” “the laity,” and “the general public.”

"But perhaps the most telling finding here is that, despite younger age and ordination cohorts trending more conservative/orthodox both politically and theologically, the overwhelming majority of these youngest priests do value accountability to Pope Francis."


Younger priests have uplifted my heart in regard to the above. They value their relationship with, as well as their accountability to, His Holiness, Pope Francis.

Said priests set a holy, orthodox example in regard to the manner in which God has commanded us to act toward the Roman Pontiff.


Mark Thomas

Mark Thomas said...

From Mike Lewis' (Where Peter Is) "twitter" page:

"Catholic News Agency: "A new survey indicates that priests describing themselves as “progressive” are practically going “extinct” among U.S. seminary graduates, among other findings."

Mike Lewis: "Why is "conservative" paired with "orthodox", when we know that dissent from the Magisterium is widespread on the right?"


The following reply is from Patti @Patti881921424

"It’s a good question. I believe I am an ‘orthodox’ Catholic (I.e. faithfully submit to the Magisterium). I used to think that Orthodox was also ‘traditional or conservative’ but would never describe myself as either now that I’ve seen the rebellious, schismatic, error prone beliefs of the TLM crowd that have co-opted the terms."

"I understand that many people would label me as a progressive, but I don’t see myself that way at all. I am a faithful orthodox Catholic because I humbly submit to the living magisterium of the Catholic Church."

"Either you are a Catholic or you are something else. Right, left, conservative or progressive- I think these terms do not belong in the description of any practicing Catholic."


I agree with Patti. For years, I have said that in many ways, such terms as "progressive," "conservative," and "traditionalist," are meaningless. I have hoped to avoid the use of said terms. Nevertheless, I have continued to employ said terms.

As Patti noted, "Either you are a Catholic or you are something else."

That is the bottom line. That is what counts.


Mark Thomas

Mark Thomas said...

I appreciate the following from the report:

"Against the backdrop of all these challenges, priests remain largely satisfied in their ministry and few (4%) are considering leaving."

Rather than succumb to doom and gloom talk in regard to the state of Holy Mother Church, "...priests remain largely satisfied in their ministry..."

That reminds me of the story that Father McDonald posted a few days ago in regard to Cardinal Eijk. Rather than succumb to negativity in regard to the state of Holy Mother Church, Cardinal Eijk declared:

"Even when the Church declines in the whole world – and we see that the number of Catholics will dwindle around the globe, not only in Holland – that does not make a difference to me."

"I have a deep joy at the bottom of my soul because Christ called me to be a priest. Nobody can take that joy from me. Nothing. That joy remains. Even when the number of churchgoers is dwindling, the joy of the priesthood remains in me."


Mark Thomas

Fr. Michael J. Kavanaugh said...

Well, you've got political and theological spheres that may or may not overlap. Venn Diagrams, anyone?. One can be politically progressive and theologically orthodox at the same time.

One of the comments on the Pillar post begins, "I think it is important (for everyone, but especially for priests) to be able to distinguish between theological orthodoxy and political conservatism. The two are sometimes aligned, sometimes in tension, and sometimes simply apples and oranges." So true...

There's also the question of defining "conservative" and "progressive" in the political and theological spheres.

Is a Catholic Young Earth creationist "conservative" theologically?

Is someone who works to support or enact legislation based on Catholic social justice doctrine a "liberal/progressive?"

The one constant ins life is . . . Change!