The reporter should be fired for not doing his homework and then putting out in public a false story in order to raise expectations that the synod in October will allow Catholics in adulterous relationships to receive Holy Communion as though adultery is no big deal and not an impediment to receiving Holy Communion as it is a mortal sin. Institutionalizing adultery or fornication or sodomy by a legal contract that America now calls civil marriage makes a mockery out of true, God revealed marriage and thus a sacrilege in addition to a mortal sin.
This story below reminds me of those programs where a so-called reporter goes out and asks basic questions about history, current politics and political leaders not to mention basic civics and those being asked are clueless.
In this case the reporter is clueless:
In a new sign of openness to Roman Catholics who have divorced then remarried, Pope Francis said they have not been excommunicated and should not be treated as such.
“These people are not at all excommunicated, they are not excommunicated, and they must absolutely not be treated as such: they are still part of the Church,” Francis said at his weekly general audience on Wednesday in St. Peter’s Square.
Francis said there was a greater realization that they should be given “a brotherly and attentive welcome.” His remarks point to a possible change in the Catholic Church’s stand on remarried divorced persons, who are banned from receiving communion.
In Rome last October, bishops at an extraordinary Synod, or meeting, on the family first raised the question whether divorced Catholics could receive communion in a draft document, then deleted the passage in the final version. A Synod on the family has been called for this October.
My Comment: Nothing new here, nothing to see, move on!
This is a synopsis of what the Holy Father actually said this morning at his audience. Nothing new here and most parishes in the USA do what the Holy Father is saying to do and has been said for almost 45 years. In his list of what divorced and remarried Catholics should do, no where does Pope Francis tell them to receive Holy Communion or even hint that they should:
(Vatican Radio) Pope Francis resumed his General Audiences on Wednesday, following the summer holiday. In his catechesis, the Holy Father continued his teaching on the family, reflecting on the situation of those who have divorced and entered into a second union.
“The Church knows well,” he said, “that such a situation contradicts the Christians Sacrament.” However, he continued, the Church, as a Mother, always seeks the good and salvation of all her children. Precisely because these situations especially affect children, the Pope said it is important for the Church to foster a true welcome for these families in our communities. The Church must always show her pastoral care for those in such situations, especially the children.
Pope Francis noted that the Church in recent decades has developed a greater awareness of the need to be welcoming the divorced and re-married. He emphasized that they are still part of the Church – they are not excommunicated, and should not be treated as such, but rather must be encouraged, with their families, to participate in the Church’s life, through prayer, listening to the Word of God, the Christian education of their children, and service to the poor. He pointed to the words of Pope Benedict XVI, who called for careful discernment and wise pastoral accompaniment, while recognizing that there are no “simple solutions” to the difficulties wounded families face.
The Church, Pope Francis said, should imitate the Good Shepherd, welcoming all her children as a mother who is willing to give her life for them. “Each one of us can do our part by having the attitude of the Good Shepherd, Who knows every one of His sheep, and excludes no one from His infinite love.
UPDATE FROM RORATE CAEILI:
IMPORTANT: POPE - Couples who are "in a second union" are "part of the Church" - but the Pope also mentions Familiaris Consortio 84
What does this signal for the October
"Family Synod"? We shall see. From Vatican Radio (we shall add the full
English text of the audience following official translation):
(Vatican Radio) Pope Francis resumed his General Audiences on Wednesday, following the summer holiday. In his catechesis, the Holy Father continued his teaching on the family, reflecting on the situation of those who have divorced and entered into a second union.
“The Church knows well,” he said, “that such a situation contradicts the Christian Sacrament.” However, he continued, the Church, as a Mother, always seeks the good and salvation of all her children. The Pope said it is important for the Church to foster a true welcome for these families in our communities. The Church must always show her pastoral care for those in such situations, especially the children.
However, it should be noted with
care that the Pope, apparently for the first time in these discussions
initiated by himself, expressly mentioned in the Italian text of the Audience, an open reference to John Paul II's Familiaris Consortio 84. It is precisely FC 84 that includes the essential teaching on the matter, following unchanging Catholic doctrine:
However, the Church reaffirms her practice, which is based upon Sacred Scripture, of not admitting to Eucharistic Communion divorced persons who have remarried. They are unable to be admitted thereto from the fact that their state and condition of life objectively contradict that union of love between Christ and the Church which is signified and effected by the Eucharist. Besides this, there is another special pastoral reason: if these people were admitted to the Eucharist, the faithful would be led into error and confusion regarding the Church's teaching about the indissolubility of marriage.
Reconciliation in the sacrament of Penance which would open the way to the Eucharist, can only be granted to those who, repenting of having broken the sign of the Covenant and of fidelity to Christ, are sincerely ready to undertake a way of life that is no longer in contradiction to the indissolubility of marriage. This means, in practice, that when, for serious reasons, such as for example the children's upbringing, a man and a woman cannot satisfy the obligation to separate, they "take on themselves the duty to live in complete continence, that is, by abstinence from the acts proper to married couples."
So it does seem that the Pope
might be preparing the ground for a turnaround on expectations on what
is actually possible: that is, welcoming couples, but not changing
doctrine at all, and certainly not regarding the Sacraments of Penance
and Eucharist.
24 comments:
Having read the passage you posted, it appears the Pope made his statements at a general audience, not in an interview. Nobody had the opportunity to question the Pontiff.
However, it was the Pope himself who said there is "a greater realization" that the divorced should be welcomed.
The writer's point is that the Pope himself chose to discuss the subject, point out the non-excommunication policy and describe that "greater realization."
Because we know that what the Pope speaks about, or not speak about, is significant, that is the point of the story, not the old policy.
Jeesh, if you're going to call someone stupid, you should read the full article and try to understand it.
The reporter makes it sound like a new thing which it isn't. It is over 45 years old and the Holy Father is simply repeating what is already known by us who heard it first 45 years ago. It's history. This reporter doesn't know Church history. That's my point, otherwise, he would say that the Holy Father simply reiterated a 45 year old acknowledgement that garnered headlines 45 years ago in the secular media and rightfully so at the time.
Actually, the writer doesn't say that. It's a fairly straightforward account of the Pope's statements. It is he who introduced the idea that a "greater realization" is needed about a place in the church for divorced.
I believe you are jumping to conclusions not supported by the story, based on your suspicions that most of us are "dumb, ignorant, stupid."
It would hardly make sense for the writer to note that divorced Catholics are banned from communion if he/she also believed the were excommunicated.
But TT, you are testy. The reporter writes "In a new sign of openness to Roman Catholics who have divorced then remarried, Pope Francis said they have not been excommunicated and should not be treated as such."
I am complaining about the reporter's words that what Pope Francis said, is a "new sign of openness" as though this hasn't been going on since the late 1960's when it was heavily (and at time inaccurately) covered by the secular media. The reporter does not know that what the pope is saying "IS NOT NEW!" It is over 45 years old.
Pope Francis noted that the Church in recent decades has developed a greater awareness of the need to be welcoming the divorced and re-married. He emphasized that they are still part of the Church – they are not excommunicated, and should not be treated as such, but rather must be encouraged, with their families, to participate in the Church’s life, through prayer, listening to the Word of God, the Christian education of their children, and service to the poor.
So, does no one see the end result here?
Priests will stop preaching about mortal sin altogether, if they have not done so already, and the need for repentance and conversion.
Which priest, who wants to be "welcoming" to adulterers (that's technically what they are) in the manner this pope apparently wants done, knowing that young children of adulterous marriages are sitting in the pews right next to their invalidly married parents, is going to give a sermon stating the truth that invalidly married Catholics are in the state of mortal sin and will, without a cessation of that sin, end up in the eternal fires of hell?
Which priest is going to do that?
And which "Director of Religious Education" would have the fortitude to teach the children of these adulterous couples that their parents are in the state of mortal sin and will end up in hell if they do not convert their lives?
Who is going to do that?
Which catechist is going to use the Catechism of the Catholic Church for catechesis with such children? Is he/she going to skip over the part about adultery?
If the priest remains silent, knowing that some of his parishioners risk the fires of hell, is that the pope's idea of welcoming such people? To what end?
The priest is going to, by his silence, allow some of his parishioners to go to hell instead of warning them, like Christ did?
That's not mercy; that's hate.
"They have not been excommunicated and (the important part here) should not be treated as such."
It's obviously pastoral advice about treatment of the divorced, not a change of policy. Again, it's clear from the context and the line about communion that the writer understood.
Be good. Have a nice rest of the day.
I agree with Fr. McDonald's take on this.
My reading is that the results we're going to get from all this are:
1. Lots of sappy, unnecessary, meaningless language on "welcoming" the remarried.
2. Some changes in the non-doctrinal practices related to the remarried, like being godparents etc, and streamlining the annulment procedure.
3. The teaching on communion for the remarried won't change.
If true, these results would be unnecessary and ill-advised, but ultimately not heterodox.
MR, I must respectfully disagree with your understanding of heterodoxy. If a practice leads to unnecessary and ill-advised results, then the purity of the doctrine has become meaningless. This is nothing less than a proper manifestation of heterodoxy in action.
We all need to pray for the pope that he comes to understand the Church's teaching on mercy and put it into practice.
August 5, 2015 at 9:47 AM...Blogger DJR said...
"So, does no one see the end result here? Priests will stop preaching about mortal sin altogether, if they have not done so already, and the need for repentance and conversion. Which priest, who wants to be "welcoming" to adulterers (that's technically what they are) in the manner this pope apparently wants done, knowing that young children of adulterous marriages are sitting in the pews right next to their invalidly married parents, is going to give a sermon stating the truth that invalidly married Catholics are in the state of mortal sin and will, without a cessation of that sin, end up in the eternal fires of hell?
"Which priest is going to do that? And which "Director of Religious Education" would have the fortitude to teach the children of these adulterous couples that their parents are in the state of mortal sin and will end up in hell if they do not convert their lives? Who is going to do that?"
"The priest is going to, by his silence, allow some of his parishioners to go to hell instead of warning them, like Christ did? That's not mercy; that's hate."
===================================================================================
Dear DJR,
Here is a link to today's General Audience as broadcast by Vatican Television:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOzhM_AyLZQ
The first 15:30 is video of Pope Francis walking among the pilgrims at today's General Audience. It is beautiful to watch His Holiness bless his people, particularly children.
It is beautiful to watch the Pope and the pilgrims shake hands...cry...laugh...smile...hand Pope Francis' gifts...some are drawings by children.
At the 38:03 mark, as Pope Francis looks on, is the English summation of today's teaching by Pope Francis.
It was noted immediately that Pope Francis declared that divorced and remarried Catholics have violated the Church's Sacrament of Holy Matrimony. The Pope did not hesitate to call attention to said sin.
The Pope then called for divorced and remarried Catholics to participate as they are able in the life of the Church. They are to attend Mass, hear the Word of God, and ensure that any children they have are to be raised in the Faith.
Pope Francis focused particularly upon the children of divorced and remarried Catholics. It is of great importance that divorced and remarried Catholics keep their children within the Church.
Pope Francis reiterated simply the Church's blueprint in dealing with divorced and remarried Catholics.
None of the concerns that you expressed applies to that which Pope Francis said today. Any priest could and should follow today's blueprint as expressed by Pope Francis.
His Holiness Pope Francis today called attention to the fact that divorced and remarried Catholics have sinned. Pope Francis did not hesitate to note said fact.
Therefore, why would a priest hesitate to do so?
His Holiness Pope Francis then preached a message of mercy and hope...divorced and remarried Catholics should attend Mass, hear the Word of God...raise their children in the Faith.
By keeping them close to the Church, there is hope that divorced and remarried Catholics will respond in full to the Church's teachings in regard to the manner in which they must amend their lives.
DJR, the Church's merciful and hope-filled approach to divorced and remarried Catholics, as outlined today by His Holiness Pope Francis, is sound and beautiful.
Mark Thomas
Mark, you are correct that what the pope apparently said today is very good.
Here's the problem: he caused all of this. He opened the door for the discussion. He let Cardinal Kasper parade his errant ideas into the public. He did nothing to give the appearance that Kasper's proposal was incorrect. He caused a preliminary document to be published and that document has been described by other churchmen as the worst ever published by the Vatican. He has allowed the German Church to go into de facto schism over this issue. He is continuing to allow the discussion of this closed issue to take place. He is doing this even though the confusion in the world in palpable.
So, yes, he should be reinforcing the Church's teaching at this point considering he caused much of the scandal in the first place.
He is the pope. We should expect him to promote the Church's doctrine and practice.
I agree that Pope Francis has allowed himself to be spun and I mean spun by the media on a number of topics. Often His Holiness is a victim of this spinning, but he set himself up as the anti-Benedict from the very first second of his election. And the press saw it as did everyone else in the world and took it for a ride.
Pope Francis while touted as humble, is not. Pope Benedict was/is. It has nothing to do with showing off that one is different than his predecessor in terms of living quarters, papal wear and simplicity of language. For a truly humble person, he takes what he is given, be a mozzetta, fannon, papal palace and limousines. He can adjust these over time.
But Pope Francis has been very clear in his teachings if one bothers to read them and study the context. The press yanks things out of context. The "Who am I to judge" comment is the worst of it and it is the press that has done it!
Yes, his love for Cardinal Kasper and from day one in promoting a book of his at the Angelus was a tactical error if not disaster and then to invite him to be the primary speaker with all the cardinals set heart rates rushing that Pope Francis was truly the anti-Benedict and possibly the first anti-pope in several centuries. We've had them before.
I think time and a recognition of the polarization His Holiness is causing and the fact he has angered and alienated those who work closest with him in the curia and college of bishops is bringing some sobriety to his papacy and a course correction.
He has clearly distanced himself from Cardinal Kasper especially after the stunning and racist African comment Kasper made to a report that he then lied about only to find out it had been recorded. I credit this to the Holy Spirit.
The final draft of last year's synod reflected a course correction and damage control
Father, your comment at 1:26 might be your first post about this pope with which I agree.
We need to pray, pray, pray and fast for the pope -- not because it is this pope, but because he is the pope.
Yes, excellent comment @ 1:26, Father. Thank you.
Our role as Catholics is to pray for the Holy Father.
Look to the words of Jesus to Peter: "Who do you say that I am?" And, most importantly, Peter's answer: "You are the Christ, the Son of God." That relationship, no matter how flawed at times by human understanding or personalities, or even sin, remains the foundation of our Church. And we were promised that the Church would prevail.
Father, if I may add to my previous post...
DJR is concerned with the approach to divorced and remarried Catholics that His Holiness Pope Francis outlined today.
Pope Francis reiterated the Church's merciful and hopeful approach to said folks. The Pope noted that divorced and remarried Catholics have violated God's teaching in regard to the Sacrament of Holy Matrimony.
Then, rather than bash and trash said folks...rather than offer them fire and brimstone...Pope Francis, in the manner of the Good Shepherd, offered God's mercy and hope to divorced and remarried Catholics.
Pope Francis' General Audience today reminded me of the merciful and hopeful manner in which Pope Francis has, for example, dealt with the Society of Saint Pius X.
Many conservatives and liberals despise the SSPX. They have exhorted Rome for decades to declare the SSPX heretical...schismatic...to excommunicate the SSPX...to hurl fire and brimstone upon the SSPX.
As I noted yesterday on Father's blog, Bishop Fellay met last September in Rome with Cardinal Muller.
Many Traditionalists, via the Catholic Blogosphere, had predicted that "evil", "modernist", "Tradition-hating" Pope Francis would excommunicate Bishop Fellay and the Society..."Get ready, folks. Modernist Pope Francis is about to reveal his true colors."
Many conservatives and liberals had hoped for the above.
His Holiness Pope Francis responded instead to the SSPX with the message of mercy and hope.
Pope Francis indeed had revealed his true colors...that of the Good Shepherd.
Today, His Holiness has responded to divorced and remarried Catholics as would the Good Shepherd. Pope Francis called to mind the sin involved in divorce and remarriage. Pope Francis then offered mercy and hope to divorced and remarried Catholics.
What is wrong with that?
Mark Thomas
MT, you hit the nail on the head. Pope Francis is a pastor (Shepherd) which in other languages is the same word. He approaches people as a pastor, not a bureaucrat and wants to pull them in.
Pastoral ministry is fraught with judgment calls and even making mistakes here and there. He knows that. Pastoral ministry can't be dogmatized or lifted to an infallible level.
I don't recall anyone being concerned that the pope would excommunicate the SSPX. Perhaps there were some people worried about that. I don't think anyone associated with the SSPX expressed those concerns.
At any rate, it should be noted what "mercy" actually means. It requires that the person recognize their sin and repent. Stated simply, mercy is conditional.
So, when the pope or anyone else clearly presents the Church's teaching so that people who are involved in some sin are able to come to recognize their sinful state and repent, then mercy has been effectively preached.
The problem arises when some present mercy as if it were not "conditional" and requires no prior act of recognition and contrition on the part of the mercy seeker.
Of course, those who are divorced and "remarried" always have hope -- the hope that they will be able to extricate themselves from their sin, approach the Sacrament of Penance, and return to the loving embrace of God. That is how merciful our Blessed Lord is! He is always there, waiting hopefully for people to be converted and repent.
Pastorally, there may be individual difficulties involved in that process -- practical considerations such as children from the sinful union. Those things should, as they have always been, be dealt with individually once the person recognizes their sin and comes to repentance.
This is much less complicated an issue in the general sense than it has been presented to be. It is a sin to attempt to "remarry" when one is already married. If I were to say otherwise, I would be a heretic. If anyone says otherwise, they are a heretic regardless of their station in the Church.
I don't know if you love this pope or not, but you gotta believe Governor Cuomo of New York does!
Mark Thomas said...
Then, rather than bash and trash said folks...rather than offer them fire and brimstone...Pope Francis, in the manner of the Good Shepherd, offered God's mercy and hope to divorced and remarried Catholics.
So, popes of the past who offered fire and brimstone to people in adulterous marriages were not acting in the manner of the Good Shepherd?
I disagree completely with the analysis of how "the Good Shepherd" acted. It is not consistent with what we read in the Gospels.
Our Lord warned His "adulterous generation" many, many times that, unless they repent, they would die in their sins. He minced no words.
He told people to "go, and sin no more."
Saint Peter's first sermon, on Pentecost Sunday, ends with the words "save yourselves from this perverse generation." And the way that was done was to "repent."
Oftentimes missing completely from these discussions are abandoned spouses who remain faithful to the Church. What about their rights?
The priest is supposed to welcome the second (false) family with "open doors" while the abandoned spouse and her children are sitting in the pew across from them?
Doesn't a priest have a duty to tell the abandoner to return to his (true) spouse and family?
Does anyone in his/her right mind think that such a situation would work? Good Lord.
Having found the lost sheep, the shepherd would customarily break one of its legs. By the time it had healed, the animal would have learned to stay with the flock. Listeners in first-century Palestine would have been well aware of this.
DJR said..."I disagree completely with the analysis of how "the Good Shepherd" acted. It is not consistent with what we read in the Gospels.
======================================================
DJR, His Holiness Pope Francis has never minced words. Pope Francis has time and again exhorted us to flee Satan. Pope Francis has exhorted us to go to Confession and sin no more. Pope Francis has time and again exhorted Catholics to aim high for holiness.
Pope Francis has also preached endlessly the incredible mercy and forgiveness that is associated with the Good Shepherd.
Below are excerpts from Pope Francis...he did not mince words when it came to sin...he also offered the tremendous mercy, forgiveness, and hope that is found in the Gospel.
On October 2, 2013 A.D., during his Wednesday General Audience, Pope Francis declared:
=====================================================
"Dear Brothers and Sisters, Good morning!
"God says to you: do not be afraid of holiness, do not be afraid to aim high, to let yourself be loved and purified by God, do not be afraid to let yourself be guided by the Holy Spirit.
"Let us be infected by the holiness of God. Every Christian is called to sanctity;
"Let us not lose the hope of holiness, let us follow this path. Do we want to be saints? The Lord awaits us, with open arms; he waits to accompany us on the path to sanctity.
"Dear brother, dear sister, this is exactly what the Lord wants, that you say to him: “Lord, here I am, with my sins”. Is one of you here without sin? Anyone? No one, not one of us.
"But the Lord wants to hear us say to him: “Forgive me, help me to walk, change my heart!”.
"And the Lord can change your heart. In the Church, the God we encounter is not a merciless judge, but like the Father in the Gospel parable.
"You may be like the son who left home, who sank to the depths, farthest from the Gospel. When you have the strength to say: I want to come home, you will find the door open. God will come to meet you because he is always waiting for you, God is always waiting for you, God embraces you, kisses you and celebrates.
"The Lord wants us to belong to a Church that knows how to open her arms and welcome everyone, that is not a house for the few, but a house for everyone, where all can be renewed, transformed, sanctified by his love, the strongest and the weakest, sinners, the indifferent, those who feel discouraged or lost.
"The Church offers all the possibility of following a path of holiness, that is the path of the Christian: she brings us to encounter Jesus Christ in the Sacraments, especially in Confession and in the Eucharist; she communicates the Word of God to us, she lets us live in charity, in the love of God for all.
"Let us ask ourselves then, will we let ourselves be sanctified?
"Are we a Church that calls and welcomes sinners with open arms, that gives courage and hope, or are we a Church closed in on herself? Are we a Church where the love of God dwells, where one cares for the other, where one prays for the others?"
Mark Thomas
Lefebvrian said..."Here's the problem: he caused all of this. He opened the door for the discussion. He let Cardinal Kasper parade his errant ideas into the public. He did nothing to give the appearance that Kasper's proposal was incorrect. He caused a preliminary document to be published and that document has been described by other churchmen as the worst ever published by the Vatican. He has allowed the German Church to go into de facto schism over this issue. He is continuing to allow the discussion of this closed issue to take place. He is doing this even though the confusion in the world in palpable.
"So, yes, he should be reinforcing the Church's teaching at this point considering he caused much of the scandal in the first place."
===============================================================
Lefebvrian, I appreciate much of the above.
I believe that Pope Francis made a major mistake at last year's Extraordinary Synod. He should have stemmed immediately the controversy related to the mid-term relation. He didn't. We can't change that fact.
Mark Thomas
Mark Thomas said... DJR, His Holiness Pope Francis has never minced words. Pope Francis has time and again exhorted us to flee Satan. Pope Francis has exhorted us to go to Confession and sin no more. Pope Francis has time and again exhorted Catholics to aim high for holiness.
When the pope speaks, he does not "mince words." I agree. Particularly when he is insulting people.
But the problem is that he says, or does, one thing at one time, and a different thing at a different time.
Does this pope believe, as the Catholic Church dogmatically teaches, that outside the Church there is no salvation?
He is on record, albeit while an ordinary, of undermining the previous pope's initiatives to convert Anglicans to the only true church. I agree he did not mince words at that time, but those words were wrong.
And it is just absolutely contrary to any Sensus Catholicus for a Catholic bishop to kneel down next to a Protestant minister to receive that minister's "blessing." It is also contrary to any Sensus Catholicus to have a "Tango Mass."
The pope, while ordinary, did both those things.
There's something very wrong there.
Is he the pope? Yes, of course. But so was John XII.
What "record" exists of then-Cardinal Bergoglio "undermining the previous pope's initiatives to convert Anglicans to the only true church."
Mark Thomas
Apparently Bergoglio invited the Anglican bishop, Greg Venables to breakfast with him and told him the Ordinariate was 'quite unnecessary'. Since he might have anticipated that his interlocutor would spill the beans (and Venables indeed did so after Bergoglio was elected Pope) he is unlikely to have openly criticized Anglicanorum Coetibus, which is after all an Apostolic Constitution. Nor can it be expected that he knew much about the situation in England, Australia or North America. An Ordinariate for the 'southern cone' is probably unnecessary. The English hierarchy were distinctly lukewarm at first, for different reasons. They are now much more supportive.
Since becoming Pope, Francis has done nothing to impede the Ordinariate; on the contrary he has broadened its scope and signed off its distinctive liturgy. I think he sees himself as a bridge-builder, between different factions in the Church, between the Church and other Christian bodies, with other religions, with secular society. If so, good luck to him.
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