From Crux:
Vatican debunks fake pope quotes on Christian/Muslim merger
- Associated PressJanuary 2, 2017
Pope Francis celebrates a new year's Mass in St. Peter's Basilica at the Vatican, Sunday, Jan. 1, 2017. (AP Photo/Andrew Medichini.)
Vatican spokesman Greg Burke says quotes used to suggest that Pope Francis wants to combine Islam and Christianity, which have circulated widely on various web sites and news outlets since 2015, are "invented."
A widely shared story that claimed Pope Francis called for merging Islam and Christianity is false.
The story falsely quotes Francis as telling a Vatican audience: “Jesus Christ, Mohammed, Jehovah, Allah. These are all names employed to describe an entity that is distinctly the same across the world. For centuries, blood has been needlessly shed because of the desire to segregate our faiths.”
Another quote it falsely attributes to Francis: “We can accomplish miraculous things in the world by merging our faiths, and the time for such a movement is now.”
Those lines attributed to Pope Francis have circulated widely on various web sites for some time, and were picked up in 2015, among other places, by the Drudge Report in 2015.
Vatican spokesman Greg Burke tells The Associated Press, however, that the quotes are “invented.”
An internet search reveals the fake quotes and various incarnations of the story have been shared by numerous websites since at least 2015.
In keeping with his predecessors, including both St. Pope John Paul II and emeritus Pope Benedict XVI, Francis has repeatedly pledged himself to closer ties with other faiths, and routinely meets leaders of other Christian churches and other religions.
At the same time, Francis, again in keeping with his predecessors, has also stressed the important of maintaining a clear sense of what makes Christianity distinct, warning in November 2015, for instance, that believers must not put their Christian identity “up for auction.”
30 comments:
Well, it certainly would not surprise me.
Gotta stop talking in his sleep.
One must understand why these stories happen, as the Pope you must state that ROMAN CATHOLICISM IS THE ONE TRUE FAITH. I don't believe this story, however this is a Pope who for his entire papacy has stated many many un-Catholic and YES sometime anti-Catholic positions, fudge them as you may, but folks he says some outlandish things you cannot defend everything Francis says and blame a "misunderstanding" of what he meant, in these times of the internet that does not work anymore. Yes I admit a fan of his I'am not, and yes I will be praying for a Pope who will implement the Traditional Latin Mass and the Traditional sacraments, my list of course are: Burke and Ranjith. There is no doubt this pope has an affinity for ISLAM, why I have no idea, a religion it is NOT, it kills, maims, beheads, blows up, crashes jets into buildings, kills Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Jews, other Muslims, and throws GAYS off the tops of buildings in the de-facto capital of the Caliphate Raqqa Syria. ISLAM IS ISLAM I don't call it Radical ISLAM, to say that is just like saying NAZI'S and radical NAZI'S no difference folks.
Take a look at Holland, France, Germany, England, Belgium, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Austria, and YES even Catholic Italy and Spain, women on the streets of these cities covered head to toe in the hijab, niqab, burka looking like you were in the Middle East. The churches in Europe either Catholic or Lutheran are empty! The cathedrals are mere tourist attractions lovely to look at but the local population does not attend them, the Europeans have nothing to fight for, they have abandoned Christianity and no longer have families, so what would they fight for? Francis tells them to bring in more and more MUSLIMS, and stop saying MIGRANTS these are invaders folks NOT MIGRANTS. The one thing I can say about ISLAM that I agree with is, at least MUSLIMS they say ISLAM is the TRUE religion, Rome stopped saying that right after the Second Vatican Council and yet we have people asking why has Europe ceased being Christian, GROW UP already and start stating the facts like I have in the aforementioned. Either Christ is The Lord and Savior or Allah is, that is where we stand.
Father McDonald:
I agree with the answer to your first question. I would only add that it is not just animosity, division, and chaos in the Catholic Church. In answer to your second question, I would speculate, sadly, at least some and possibly many.
Anonymous:
You say that one must understand why this is happening. I agree. The explanation is very complex, and I certainly do not understand all of it (who does?). But part of the explanation is that it is happening for the same reason you so unjustly mischaracterize the entire faith of Islam, and part of it, too, is the answer to Father McDonald’s first question. And part of it also has much to do with understandable fear, sometimes well founded but often unfounded, and with how evil forces use that fear against us for their own nefarious purposes.
Men do the fighting for offense and for defense. Yes yes, we all know stories of the spunky teen girl and heroic momma grizzly snipers, but they are anomalies in warfare. By and large from the time of Cain, it's been men who man the bastions and men who storm the city gates.
And young men at that.
So demographics counts regardless of whiz-bang firepower. Sheer numbers of young hot blooded men who have girlfriends and wives and lots of children back home....count.
Europe is awash in young military age middle eastern or north African MEN while European men are by and large a dying and sheepish, shamed and confused lot scared of their own shadows and ashamed and aghast at their parents and grandparents.
So even though white European men still are a majority and still inhabit the majority of police and military units, to the degree they have no wives and children, no pride of nation or faith to back them up, they're weak and surrendering without much resistance to the barbarians at their gates, raping their daughters and pillaging their cultural heritage.
In the US the white male is a bit more brave - there are millions of more combat arms veterans and our cow-boy/frontiersman ethos is still out there as the largest civilian arms build up in world history in the past 7 years attests.... but we're also standing by while hordes of hot blooded young men from other cultures and other religions pour into our country full of ambition and zeal and self-confidence and cultural confidence.
None of the Hispanic, Black, or Middle Eastern young men who have immigrated (legal or not) in the past 10 years are burdened with anything like "white guilt". None are burdened with shame or guilt for their cultural heritage. None carry a feeling that their power is illegitimate and their anger unwarranted. No! They instead have chips on their shoulder and something to prove to their own honor and the good of their wives and children. They see America as theirs to take and make their own.
And their political rhetoric is already talking about a post-white America and of treating the current majority not as a live and let live Kumba ya fellow minority but as tribal/ethnic enemies to defeat and then punish for all the real and perceived sins of our ancestors.
The only force on earth that will keep humanity from tribal/ethnic cleansing wars in the future or ideological socialist totalitarian purges is Catholicism. Only raising our eyes from what divides us to what PERSON alone can unite and save us, will keep our tribes and groups from final solutions and lesser conflicts.
But we're not even having this conversation because we - I'm assuming most of us are white - are brow beat into even talking about these issues (*by other white people!) on the fear that pointing out the obvious is somehow beyond bounds, racist, xenophobic, etc.
Ignoring a demographic and ethnic sea change is not cosmopolitan, chic, cool, and smart. It's just to intentionally ignore reality. But pointing to the real demographic and ethnic changes can lead to polarization and conflict if we stop there and don't accept reality so as to elevate it to a higher plane. That's called Evangelization. But we won't do it I fear.
Anonymous 2, Islam is a false religion that worships false gods. That business about us worshiping the same god is ridiculous made up BS. The Christian's attitude toward Islam, and all other religions, should be, at least, indifference, if not suspicion. Christianity is, indeed, and exclusive faith.
Catholics in Europe could keep well ahead of Moslems to ensure the continuation of Europe's Catholic roots via the following ways:
1. The restoration of the ancient Roman Mass throughout Europe. The TLM would imbue in the hearts and minds many Catholics in Europe a strong Catholic identity.
Of course, the TLM was in place throughout Europe during the decades prior to the creation of the Novus Ordo. That didn't prevent our European Popes, Cardinals, and bishops from pursuing radical liturgical reforms.
It was Pope Venerable Pius XII, a holy man (everybody knows that), who, in goodwill, promoted in major fashion the liturgical reform that, unfortunately, failed dramatically to enhance the liturgical life of the (Latin) Church.
Pope Venerable Pius XII not only instituted radical liturgical reforms, he also launched the Church into the Ecumenical Movement (has ecumenism strengthened or weakened the Church?), tinkered with established fasting practices, and insisted that the Church must conform to "modern" man.
The TLM isn't magical in that the TLM prevents Churchmen from instituting revolutionary changes within the Church.
Therefore, alongside the restoration of the TLM throughout Europe (and elsewhere), a respectful, charitable discussion of the "liberalization" process — liturgical, ecumenical, and additional aspects — launched by Pope Venerable Pius XII and pursued to date by Rome must be undertaken within the Church.
We must discuss within the Church whether we should continue down the path paved by (and expanded by Pope Venerable Pius XII's successors) the Pian reforms.
(Of course, many people would argue that we've discussed that matter for decades within the Church. What we require is action by Rome.)
Pope Benedict XVI declared, the Faith faces virtual death in many parts of the world. That includes, without question, Europe (and the West). Therefore, it is imperative that the Church determine as soon as possible whether to continue down the road paved by the Pian reforms.
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2. The determination among Catholics to generate large families. That would prevent Islam from dominating the West via population growth.
In regard to large families among Catholics, I offer the following from His Holiness Pope Francis:
"Healthy families are essential to the life of a society. It gives consolation and hope to see so many large families that welcome children as a gift from God. They know that every child is a blessing.
"Looking to the figure of St Joseph, who protected the life of the “Santo Niño”, much venerated in that land, I recalled that we need to protect families who are being threatened in different ways so that they can bear witness to the beauty of the family in God’s plan.
"We also need to defend the family from new ideological colonizations that threaten its identity and mission."
Pax.
Mark Thomas
St. Pope John Paul II, address to the Catholic community of Ankara, Turkey, November 29, 1979: “My brothers, when I think of this spiritual heritage (Islam) and the value it has for man and for society, its capacity of offering, particularly in the young, guidance for life, filing the gap left by materialism, and giving a reliable foundation to social and juridical organization, I wonder if it is not urgent, precisely today when Christians and Muslims have entered a new period of history, to recognize and develop the spiritual bonds that unite us, in order to preserve and promote together for the benefit of all men, ‘peace, liberty, social justice and moral values’ as the Council calls upon us to do (Nostra Aetate 3)."
St. Pope John Paul II, address to representatives of Muslims of the Philippines, February 20, 1981 “Dear Muslims, my brothers: I would like to add that we Christians, just like you, seek the basis and model of mercy in God himself, the God to whom your Book gives the very beautiful name of al-Rahman, while the Bible calls him al-Rahum, the Merciful One.”
Pope Benedict XVI, address to the representatives of the Muslim communities, Castel Gandolfo, September 25, 2006 "The circumstances which have given rise to our gathering are well known. I have already had occasion to dwell upon them in the course of the past week. In this particular context, I should like to reiterate today all the esteem and the profound respect that I have for Muslim believers, calling to mind the words of the Second Vatican Council which for the Catholic Church are the Magna Carta of Muslim-Christian dialogue: "The Church looks upon Muslims with respect. They worship the one God living and subsistent, merciful and almighty, Creator of heaven and earth, who has spoken to humanity and to whose decrees, even the hidden ones, they seek to submit themselves whole-heartedly, just as Abraham, to whom the Islamic faith readily relates itself, submitted to God"
Pope Benedict XVI, address to the representatives of the Muslim community of Cameroon, Yaoundé, March 19, 2009 "With these sentiments, I once again express my gratitude for this auspicious occasion to meet you during my visit to Cameroon. I thank Almighty God for the blessings he has bestowed upon you and your fellow citizens, and I pray that the links that bind Christians and Muslims in their profound reverence for the one God will continue to grow stronger, so that they will reflect more clearly the wisdom of the Almighty, who enlightens the hearts of all mankind."
No, Gene, "this business" is not made up.
Our attitude to any other religion should be respect for the believers but no respect for the foreign 'faith' beyond those elements that are true in a naturalistic or natural law sense. So a Buddhist's teaching on nonviolence and harmony is good....but the Buddha was actually wrong - factually and spiritually wrong that desire is the cause of suffering rather than sin and hence negating desire is the solution - rather than embracing one's cross out of love for the Lord!
I can respect a Muslim's insistence to pray 5 times a day or fast and his devotion to the very name of God. but Allah as the Muslims understand him is not the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. The Allah preached by Mohammed is a slave master, NOT a Father.
Similarly with Jews. I can respect them as men- almost all are literate, well read, and civilized. Their scripture is our own. Their liturgical traditions backstop our own. But they await a Messiah that isn't coming. The Messiah already came. Absent a temple and the presence of God, they have no priesthood, no sacrifice, and no prophets. Talk about lost sheep and brothers who need to be re-incorporated!
But instead we get "theologians" trying to paper over differences and de facto "non-aggression" pacts whereby we institutionally declare a truce from evangelization of their people by our official organs *(which they don't repay as ALL their institutions actively seek converts from among Catholic laity and even clergy!).
I think it's a function of confidence and attitude and possibly of age too. With our clergy being in their 50s or 60s and tired....and having no wives or children of their own to care for.... the idea of risking the present for the sake of tomorrow is pushed back for the sake of peace and quiet in the here and now. No rocking the boat. No rolling the dice. Keep things nice and calm and no loud noises please!
If our clergy were men of their 20s and our bishops men of their 40s I'd bet our Church would be decidedly more triumphalistic and unapologetically missionary.
Liberals love to knock conservatives when it comes to living in the "good old days" of 1940's and 50's America, well watching each year as I do during the Christmas season I love to watch Bing Crosby in "Going my Way", "The Bells of St. Mary's", and Loretta Young in "Come to Stable", yes all with Traditional Latin Mass to boot. However not having been born yet I feel such a pull towards that era in America when Hollywood made movies about the Roman Catholic Church in a very positive way, produced and directed most times by Jewish people in the industry. Catholics and Jews have a special bond, even more so now with the advent of ISLAMIC IMPERIALISM, remember that our Jewish brothers in Israel are surrounded by over 400,000.000 MUSLIMS who wish to push them into the Mediterranean, and seek the complete and utter domination of Europe not by force but by SHEER BIRTHRATE. Folks we must stand with our Jewish brethren to stop the spread of this ISLAMIC CANCER, Europe is lost but we in the States have the power now with TRUMP to once and for all send them back to the 9th century which they love to be in.
Kavanaugh, read a bit about the founding of Islam. If you still think we worship the same god, you are just as big an idiot as I already think you are. The Church is just playing PC games and it is dangerously wrong.
Anonymous @12:23
You actually bring up something interesting that I have thought about.
There are a myriad of ex-Catholic countries, the ones you listed plus more: most of Central America, South America on the way out.
There are also many former Protestant countries: Norway, Sweden, Lutheran German, etc.
The thing I find most interesting is that you don't find any former Orthodox countries. At least ones that have been "former" bc they have left the faith like the Catholic ones seems to have done.
Just something I think is interesting.
Okay we have reached the point where the Vatican has to deny that a pope didn't really say that Islam and Christianity should be merged. Why? Because it is very easy to believe that Francis would say this. Would anyone really be shocked if that man actually said this. And let's be real he probably believes that. That the depth we have reached, the filth that that man spews daily. Confusion chaos. The man needs to go. He has NO RIGHT TO TRY AND TURN THE HOLY ROMAN FAITH INTO THE EPISCOPAL church. And that is EXACTLY what he is trying to do. He can take a hike, I will NEVER ascent to accepting adultery or sodomy or any of the other filth he is trying to rationalize. The time for the faithful bishops and priests of the world is long past to rise up and demand that man stop this or step aside or be declared a heretic and removed. Do something! Stop this. It is unjust to millions of souls to be lead down the road to destruction because of the arrogance of one Jesuit. EVIL!
Anon - No, YOU have reached this point because YOU want to believe that Pope Francis is destroying the Church.
The Vatican makes denials because there are a small handful of loons who, given their own mental state, WANT to believe what the rest of the world knows at a glace is false.
Gene - I've read about the founding of Islam.
Once again, I am happy to stand with the teaching of the Church and not with you.
Whoa! Pope Francis is not evil or even doing evil things. I do think he is naive and that can open the door to evil, which is just as bad if not worse. How Catholics respond to this is what mattersmuch much more than what the Pope does.
I'm with Urban II when it comes to "Islam" - Deus Vult!
Urban II has been dead since 1099.
Enjoy your rest...
Requiescat in pace!
The quotes may be fake, but I don't put it beneath HH to say them (it's what happens when one doesn't have control of their tongue) Anon at 626 is right on this point.
When it comes to islam, in its best form it's a Christian heresy, in its worst firm it's terrorism. Pope Benedict XVI's Ragensburg address needs to be looked at again.
Joe
"The time for the faithful bishops and priests of the world is long past to rise up and demand that man stop this or step aside or be declared a heretic and removed. Do something! Stop this. It is unjust to millions of souls to be lead down the road to destruction because of the arrogance of one Jesuit. EVIL!"
"Do year hear the people sing? Singing the songs of angry men! it is the music of a people who will not be slaves again...!
Man the barricades!
rcg, Francis is hardly "naive" he is a Jesuit and an Argentine, hardly a "naive" man, he knows exactly what he says and does. He is a son of "Vatican II", and everything he has done so far shows just that, in particular of his dislike of the True Mass of All Times, and strong priests.
Anonymous said... Urban II has been dead since 1099. Enjoy your rest... Requiescat in pace!
Matthew 22:32. I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
Mark 12:27. He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You therefore do greatly err.
Luke 20:38. For he is not the God of the dead, but of the living: for all live to him.
Blessed Urban II is in Heaven.
Anonymous, Urban II is dead, but loons like you will soon be missing a head (or maybe you will be pushed off a skyscraper, since you're special) if Islam triumphs!
Urban II is dead. His mortal remains are buried under St. Peter's basilica.
TJM said he was with Urban.
TJM ain't in heaven, so....
There would be some difficult and very serious issues to face in any proposed merger between Catholicism and Mohammedanism. I for one would not take kindly to the ban on alcohol. The bit about having four wives...I'd have to think about that. Pluses and minuses.
Anonymous, well unless you change your ways you may be in Hell with Obama and Hillary since you are sympathico with them
In related news I see that the fake news and conspiracy theory crowd (The Gateway Pundit, PrisonPlanet, Trump Mafia, etc.) are at it again, this time claiming, falsely, that CNN deliberately lightened the skin of the Fort Lauderdale shooting suspect Estaban Santiago before it aired his photograph. Not only does there appear to be no evidence for this claim, the fake news crowd also got the wrong Estaban Santiago. And, of course, in the nowadays typical “projection” move, at least some of these sites gallingly assert that it is CNN which is putting out fake news:
http://www.snopes.com/did-cnn-alter-esteban-santiagos-photograph/
Now, I wonder how many people (perhaps including some readers here) were taken in by this false claim and, worse, how many will remain ignorant that it has been debunked.
We all need to keep our wits about us, folks. It’s treacherous out there.
I'm wondering if facing Mecca is better than versus populum.
Only with a crosshair overlay.
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