PI has accused me and others who like the 1962 missal and pray for a more concrete reform of the reform of the modern missal as being nostalgic for what is perceived as the good old days, usually the 1950's, although now that I'm in my 50's I think the 50's are now the good old days, so to speak!
But in the name of all that is good and holy, why are some priests who are my age and older, now in their 60's and 70's nostalgic for the 1960's and 70's? For the love of God and all that is holy, are they serious?
Listen to the hymn below that these two guitar strumming priests are leading. I haven't heard that since the 1970's! YIKES. Are they intentionally trying to be a caricature of all that was wrong with that period of time? Is this a comedy act? Sadly, no it isn't. They want a return of this crap and I presume in their parishes, the 1970's are alive and vibrant, not just in liturgy but also in mentality especially against the hierarchy, in terms of rebellion so common in that period and fomented by these very men when they were in their 20's and 30's.
This Mass occurred this past week at the Benedictine St. Leo College in Florida--men recapturing the youth of their priesthood. Is it time to commit them to the nursing home where they can't harm anyone or themselves liturgically? You watch and you decide!
As you watch these two videos, pray The Fatima Prayer over and over!
O my Jesus,
forgive us our sins,
save us from the fire of hell,
lead all souls to heaven,
especially those who are in most need of Thy mercy.
Amen.
And in this video of the same conference, you'll see very well the age group that is interested in this crap and nostalgia from the 70's. Literally, my stomach is churning so distressing do I find this. And I won't point him out, but one of our diocesan priests is in the crowd, and am I surprised? No!
If you can stomach it, read this group's mantra and then look at their website for more inspiring videos! (Is this the male version of the LCWR? Or maybe this is the the LCWR?)
"We are artists, musicians, poets, pastors and dreamers who are connecting with other pilgrims of the infinite. We are more than mildly distressed by the ecclesial turn of events since Paul VI. We have been wrecked and laid waste, devastated and destroyed ... but we are still "hanging in" ... still trying to keep hope alive, because it is the only dance there is."
LOOK IF YOU DARE AT THEIR WEBSITE BY PRESSING HERE, "ASSOCIATION OF US CATHOLIC PRIESTS"
40 comments:
Unfortunately, those priests are not alone. Our choir is composed of people who grew up during that time and it's not rare for the two women who lead the choir to opt for songs from that era. The only song remotely connected to the Holy Spirit we got to sing for Pentecost this year was "The Spirit Is A'moving". BARF!
Oh, and at least once or twice a year we are treated to the children's choir singing "His Banner Over Me Is Love" complete with gestures. Last time we heard it was this past Easter, when it was it was either the Communion or Offertory song at the only Easter Mass in our parish. We were even denied "Jesus Christ Is Risen Today" as every song they picked came out of a 70s school catechetics program.
Gabby, you can't make this stuff up! And people who deride those who desire the EF Mass and an OF Mass that resembles the EF Mass are derided! You just can't make this stuff up!
Hey! It's a party!
Father - there is a difference between criticizing a liturgical style and personally mocking and denigrating those who prefer a certain liturgical style. Is this really how Christians discuss their differences? Consider how your example will be followed in real life by some who read this blog!
The video is too poorly focused to be able to pick out anyone, but I have my short list of Diocesan Priests who would actually show up for the heterodox meeting. Of course, it is important to note that there is not a single clerical attire in the whole group. Are they ashamed of who they are?
Go to the website, it's pretty scary. Discussion topic for day 1 was "The New Missal, what's the problem and what do we do about it".
I notice they held it in Tampa, hopefully most of the 240 attendees used the opportunity to scout out retirement homes.
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Carol H. has left a new comment on your post "I CRINGE, JESUS WEEPS AND SOME PRIESTS MY AGE AND ...":
They are obviously gathering together to discuss ways to counter the direction the Pope is leading us in. Is there a way to report this?
My comment: I think most bishops know about this since it is a public gathering and on the internet.
Brigid, When I read what others have said about me on blog comments, that are not deleted, the comments on more liberal blogs, like the NCR and when I read the dribble of some of the articles on these blogs, such as ncr, this is a little bit like the pot calling the kettle black.
We are heading for a smaller but purer Church and there is no sin in that.
Today's Gospel Parable touches on this a bit:
A. Interesting is the notion that this Pope not only doesn't care if the Church shrinks, but actually desires such, as long as it purifies -- that Benedict XVI is interested in a purer, more devotional, and stricter Church, citing the strength of the Church in its early history, when it was vastly smaller than the billion-strong institution of our present day, a Church that is large but often in disagreement. Pope Benedict has spoken of a smaller, more faithful Church as perhaps the model of the Church for these perilous times, not unlike the early Church in its intense solidarity.
B. Many Biblical scholars believe that Jesus in his public ministry never intended his followers to be more than a small group in a large population. The vast majority of people would never commit themselves to the reform Jesus intended for all people. People probably told Jesus he was wasting his time preaching to people. As soon as he departed them, more than half of those to whom he spoke wouldn’t remember one thing he’d said. A small handful might and if he was lucky maybe one person would actually alter his or her behavior because of something he taught. But we must try, like the famer to sow the seed spreading it wildly and doing so with great work in hope that that which does sprout will have a dramatic effect in providing wheat for thousands. I doubt that later in this day or tomorrow must of you will have remembered I word I said in this homily, but week after week, I work hard to produce one hoping that one or two will hear it, take heed and alter their life according to the Gospel or repent if they have failed the Gospel and Church teachings.
Is it okay to bash the hierarchy and in the most egregious and unchristian of ways and not even do it politely with a bit of humor, sarcastic as it might be, but with vitriolic that makes Attila the Hun look mild in comparison?
Back when we first knew that the new English translation of the Novus Ordo Mass was imminent (and saw the whines and complaints of "progressives") my brother and I started an inside joking term to refer to groups such as this--they are the "Don't mess with the 'Ordo" crowd (meaning don't mess with or change what we've had since 1973 when we "occupied" the Church, as the above black and white photo shows). Now their version (and style) of the 'Ordo has been "messed" with and they are not happy campers!
Pft. I had read enough about the AUSCP when I saw that Mons Weakland was involved. The damage the liturgical vandals did and continue to do is a terrible, terrible thing.
And Fr Ruff, tsk, ought to retire to a monastery....
Two videos and 90 seconds I'll never get back. On the other hand who knew Purgatory would be so short?
Seriously, I will point out that these fellows are not wearing their collars nor cassocks. It is their social group and they are singing some songs that make them happy. I was contemplating that this morning during a Haugen/Haas riff. These are not so bad as Jesus Freak Songs go. They just have no place in a Catholic Mass.
Orphan Girl
And definately a '70s feel Jesus on the Mainline But not in Mass!!
As far as their agenda goes, the catalogue could use some clarification: "The New Roman Missal: What is the Problem, and What Can We Do About It? " should be "The New Roman Missal: Shut up and Sing" and the 200 best seller "he Changing Face of the Priesthood—12 Years Later: Boy, I never saw THAT Coming."
Brigid, I hear what you're saying. But consider how this appears to people who work hard to present a Mass that is catechetical as well as inspiring. It's not just that someone is mocking a person for his lack of a particular talent, but that the person is so unselfconscious he is unaware of his limitations and their impact on his art and others. Between professionals a sugar coating is an insult.
Brigid, Ridicule and sarcasm are legitimate weapons against a determined and ruthless enemy. No apologies. Toughen up...
Whoa, Pin. That was close! LOL! Seriously, check out Second Epistle of St Peter. Yikes.
Brigid, personal preference is the last thing to consider when fashioning "liturgical style". Those who profess these "styles" under the guise of Catholicism are actually deriding God with their blasphemous worship. They deserve to be called on it... The First Commandment means something and that something is quite specific for Catholics vis-a-vis public worship.
Viewing stuff like this always reminds me of a psychology article I once read, about people who have problems with authority because of early childhood toilet-training issues.
Perfect love does not entail looking the other way when the ones we care about (and we should be concerned for our priests) do something damaging. What these guys are propagating is unhealthy, both to themselves and the faith. It equivocates to navel-gazing within the context of the church. The mission statement sounds like something out of an Episcopalian "guided meditation." Artists? Pilgrims of the infinite?? Balderdash. What about men of God and followers of Christ? I do agree with the dreamer part, however.
The manner in which we worship matters. We struggle against selfishness every day. Proper liturgy equips us for the spiritual battle and protects us from self-absorption. The point is not to dally at the "dance," while Rome is burning and souls are being lost. Sorry, but if another person tells me, "God is dancing over you," I will have an additional sin to confess.
OK, RCG, I read it. So, what's your point?
Today, 11 am, the Oxford Oratory. Newman preached here, and Gerard Manley Hopkins was a curate, since this was for a long time a Jesuit church. Solemn Latin OF, with beautiful vestments of the sort AWN Pugin would have approved (remember this is a Gothic revival church).
The Mass setting was by the Tudor composer John Shepherd (1515-1560)which alternated plainsong with simple and dignified polyphony. There were two motets by William Byrd. Mass was celebrated 'ad orientem' but given how the church was built, liturgical east is in fact west!
The homily, referring to the last sermon Newman preached as an Anglican, was intellectually challenging (well, it is Oxford after all). And we are sent on our way by a splendid organ piece by Vierne - there is nothing to touch 20th century French organ music.
Reform of the reform? This is it.
Father, my own parish, and the one closer to me, which I have been attending of late, are filled with those folks. I'm afraid that in the Atlanta area, they are the rule, not the exception.
The parish closest to me is true to the Missal, and has one priest who has been preaching very explicitly on the need for Catholics to accept and live the full teachings of the Church. However, it has excruciatingly poor selections in music. They use the Gather hymnal, and are apparently huge fans of Haugen and Haas. And at the end of Mass, after the recessional, the congregation bursts into applause. Appalling.
My own parish is given to ad libs in the liturgy, and uses the Breaking Bread hymnal. Their selections are marginally less worse.
Pin, post was in two parts: the laugh about 'Harden up'. Second was the truth in your statement vis: "There were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will introduce destructive heresies and even deny the Master who ransomed them, bringing swift destruction on themselves."
And thought THIS Pope was tough....
I went to a so-called "ecumenical service" while in grad school at the U. of Chicago in 1975. It was led by a Catholic Priest and a Lutheran pastor in the commons room of the Lutheran School of Theology of Chicago. Some pitiful twerp in a turtle neck that looked like he hadn't bathed in a month was banging out folk songs on a fifty dollar gut string guitar, while his hippie girlfriend sang like some kind of three bong-hit Karen Carpenter. Then, they played Patti Page's, "Is That All There Is," on an eight-track, for God's sake, then played (you guessed it) Simon&Garfunkel's "Bridge Over Troubled Water" for the Communion hymn. Communion was with a bolle of bread from a deli down the street and a jug of Dago Red...I kid you not. Both clergy blessed the elements and, when the Catholic Priest elevated the Host, the Lutheran minister placed his hands over the Priest's...I do not lie. Then, they walked around breaking off pieces of bread and sticking it in everybody's mouth. Then, each minister took a chalice (pottery) and went around administering the Precious Blood (or whatever it had become by that point). Then we had a prayer for unity and I guess all the kids went back to their dorm rooms for marijuana and sex. Even then, as a hard core Calvinist seminary student, I thought that may have been the strangest thing I had ever seen. You just would not believe Chicago, Emory, Vandy, and
the other major Divinity Schools back then...well, you might if you believe them now...
On the issue of a smaller, purer Church:
you wrote (and mentioned this in your homily...and it bugged me then too)
part B.
"Many Biblical scholars believe that Jesus in his public ministry never intended his followers to be more than a small group in a large population."
While I can easily understand and see why you might select this statement to back up the case for a smaller Church, I wonder about the wisdom and accuracy of this statement.
Something just plain rubs me the wrong way with that statement.
First of all, is it really the place of 'biblical scholars' to tell folks what Jesus' intention was?
From what I understand, and please correct me if I am mistaken,
1. Jesus wants salvation for all his children...every last man, woman, and child.
2. Therefore, how can it be correct to say that his intention is only for a small group?
3. Jesus states that some people will not accept Him and will go to fiery Gehenna.
4. Just because He states that this will happen, doesn't mean that his intention is for that to happen.
5. Isn't His heart peirced and sorrowful because of us who will not accept Him?
I understand that the size of the Church will ebb and flow through the course of history. It has in the past and will continue to do so until Jesus Himself calls a halt to it. I have no problem with accepting or understanding that bit.
Yet, I DO take issue with saying that His INTENTION has always been for it to be an exclusive club. (Calvinism?Predestination?)It is an exclusive club because God let's have free will and many say 'no'. (Apparently the dues are too high ;- haha)
On the topic of the size of the Church...just because it is shrinking in the Western Hemisphere, and might need to have some bad members cut off, doesn't mean that it is shrinking worldwide. Look East...
If the blood of martyrs is indeed the seed of saints...then where the persecutions are is bound to flourish in the years to come.
Further East, it is already having a resurgence and growth.
Look at Africa, look at India.
~SL
Why did you do this to us?
I was having a rather nice Sunday until I watched those videos and went ot the website.
While I couldn't make out any faces, I did find a name on the website.
Oh well, I guess it's best to know the truth about these priests, even though it is disappointing.
Even though I am personally disappointed to see that name....I am going to dissent from the this group here a bit.
When a parishioner needs a pastoral touch, sometimes these preist can fit the bill...so maybe God is putting them to good use despite themselves.
~SL
These Priest are surely experiencing the same emotions as the crew of the Edmund Fitzgerald, as they were some 20 minutes from Whitefish Bay. I've tried to be diplomatic with these liberals for years and it never works. They are as loony and as unreasonable as Bp. Williamson. If we don't call crap crap, the smoke of Satan Paul VI spoke of will never leave Holy Mother Church. This is not another form of loving Christian worship.. This is Satan at his finest.
SL, I don't think FrAJM was using the opinion of some people to justify a smaller Church, but saying that many people perceive correctly that, sadly, not everyone will be a part of the Church. Christ excluded no one, but said they had to chose Him over some things and He knew some would not. Some folks say we are predestined, yet the Father offers everyone the chance, again, knowing some will pass it up. Maybe the irony is that when He opened it up for everyone, some folks used that as the reason to stay out. I have not experienced anything as nutty as what Pin describes, but I have had some strange things happen where I have to trust that this priest is actually consecrating this bread and wine and have to focus on that rather than the baggage. It can be tough and I think I really try to separate the priest as a person from persona Christi. I can only imagine what folks who are trying to incorporate some of these abuses into their understanding of the Liturgy.
Look closely at the video, and notice a few things that leave a lasting impression. There are virtually no men under the age of 60 or 70. None of them are wearing clerical garb. The style of clothing is, however, strangely "uniform" - extra-large tee shirts and sport shirts, and bermuda shorts. Virtually all of them are severely overweight or obese. It is not an edifying sight. What young man, looking at this video, would be inspired to join them?
Look closely at the video, and notice a few things that leave a lasting impression. There are virtually no men under the age of 60 or 70. None of them are wearing clerical garb. The style of clothing is, however, strangely "uniform" - extra-large tee shirts and sport shirts, and bermuda shorts. Virtually all of them are severely overweight or obese. It is not an edifying sight. What young man, looking at this video, would be inspired to join them?
Sounds like children's Mass. I kid you not, I can feel my brain dulling.
Rembert Weakland presiding? They should be ashamed of themselves.
Parishioners whose pastor is associated with this group should be fully aware of their sympathies towards Weakland. What he did in Milwaukee could happen again elsewhere.
They casual way they treat the Blessed Sacrament in these videos is quite revealing
Perhaps Fr. McDonald was getting at the idea that the size of the Church is not an indicator of whether she is correct or not. A Pope (Leo XIII?) condemned that idea (but, I can't find that cite right now).
Christ wants everyone to be part of His Church because he wants everyone to be saved. Yet, He knows that a small number will accept that invitation.
I am reminded of Christ's referring to His Church as a light set on a hill. Presumably, this is a small light that serves as a beacon and reminder to the world at large. That parable indicates the Church is small within the world, but carries a major task.
Think of the Old Testament Jews - a small group of people serving as a beacon for the Gentiles of God's Providential care.
There are so many ways to discuss this point - I think that is the mark of a good homily. I hope many were "rattled" by Father's remarks and are continuing to think about whether they have truly accepted Christ's invitation to salvation. The homily certainly makes me consider this for myself.
I use the smaller more faithful Church as Pope Benedict uses it. I don't like to see Catholics go and many leave the Church out of pure ignorance of what the Church teaches and a lack of conversion or even a desire for conversion from sinful inclinations or blantant sinful activities. Confession is not central to their Catholicism.
But there are informed Catholics, academic Catholics who know full well what the Church teaches and don't like it and proposed an anti-Catholicism (as in anti-Christ or anti-pope) a bogus form of Catholicism. The LCWR does this and some of their followers, Sister Farley, Fr. Curran, Fr. Kung do this--and this are smart people who know traditional Catholicism and rejected it and are trying to drag as many people along with them. It is like the period of the Protestant Reformation that we are living in and many are seduced by their ideologies, who really want to be religious, spiritual people, but not within traditional Catholicism and her traditional moral beliefs and liturgical practices. These ideologies need to be declared anathama and the people need to be called to accountability and re-conversion-penance and forgiveness and reconciliation to the truth! If they don't want that, then they should declare themselves outside of the tradition of the Catholic Church--they are no longer practicing Catholics!
Bravo, Father! Today is the anniversary of the Battle of Waterloo which ushered in a century of progress and (relative) peace and prosperity under the Pax Britannica.
Let's hope Kung, Curran, Farley and the rest meet their own Waterloo, and not before time.
Father, I thought you conveyed that message quite clearly in your homily. I hope people will consider the challenge you extended yesterday - essentially decide whether you are in or out. If you are out, then it is time to visibly make your move.
This is precisely what the Holy Father meant: if you are no longer Catholic, you must exit the visible Church in order to avoid corrupting the remainder. That will certainly leave a smaller visible Church. But, let's be clear that the number of actual adherents to the Faith will remain the same. We are talking here of only a recognition of an already existing fact - when one is a heretic, schismatic, or apostate, one is outside the Church, although they may appear to be in the visible Church by virtue of their Catholic baptism.
Maybe a better name for this group would be the "Catholic Second Childhood Assocation". You got the Romper Room Mass performed by a bunch of geriatrics. It fits.
BTW, contrary to what the liberal U.S. "Catholic Press" press would have you believe, this is NOT the only organization of priests out there. Check out the Confraternity of Catholic Clergy at
http://catholicclergy.net/. There's a group we can all be proud of and Pope Benedict would surely approve.
We have been wrecked and laid waste, devastated and destroyed...
Dear Fathers, as one of those who grew up in and therefore had to live through the "Spirit" of Vatican II, knowing nothing else, I would say in retrospect (now that I attend both the OF and the EF, and as such have more perspective than I used to) that you have done precisely what you describe above to us.
... but we are still "hanging in"
Just so long as you don't try to "Gather Us In" as well, you'll be about right.
... still trying to keep hope alive, because it is the only dance there is."
Is this where we all get to break into "Lord of the Dance"? ...which I think Anthony Esolen once pointed out is really about Shiva, and not Christ-- i.e. Shiva the Destroyer. That sounds about right, too, no?
All kidding and sarcasm aside, however, that stuff truly is cringe-worthy.
Brigid, this is not simply about liturgical "style." Catholic liturgy has to clearly communicate Catholic theology. That which does not should never be allowed in any Catholic Mass; that is not a matter of "taste" or "style," and Christ did not say "I'm okay, you're okay, we're all okay." Any music that distracts from Christ-- Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity Truly Present-- actually obscures Him, which most certainly is not okay. Christian charity has nothing to do with being "nice" to people who have different "tastes," but rather that we are lying to ourselves and everyone else about who and what we purport to be as Catholics by allowing this sort of thing to continue without comment. And by the way, a lot of the comments that I've read thus far are way more charitable than almost anything I'm likely to read in the comboxes of NCR (a lot of which I'd certainly had enough of around the time the new translation of the Roman Missal came out).
Speaking for myself, in attending the EF in addition to the OF, let's just say that I went from "Here I Am, Lord" to "oh, THERE you are, Lord!" Having come back to the Church through the grace of God, I can only say that I count myself among the walking wounded.
When beset by the crap that Fr. McDonald describes, there is ample opportunity to learn and relearn what it means to "offer it up," which should not have to be the case during Mass, itself.
Gabby, as Father McDonald said, you really can't make this stuff up.
The Monsignor at our parish did Benediction for the kids at the children's Mass, and the music was some awful new-agey something or other. At any rate, it seemed rather... structureless.
I don't see why the kids couldn't have learned "Tantum Ergo." The melody is repetitive, and the Latin words aren't hard. And one wonders how it is that Roman Catholic children the world over learned chants like that and "Adoro te Devote" before those adhering to "Spirit" of Vatican II decided to claim that it was "too hard!" (and therefore that it should be "too hard" for the rest of us, too, I suppose...).
This Lent, our parish choir sang the Sanctus and the Angus Dei, which I recognized from the Mass "Deus Genitor Alme." If it's any Latin Angus Dei that Everybody Kinda Knows from hearing a familiar melody, it's that one. But they sang it in English, even despite those being some of the simplest chant settings.
One of the complaints I get sick of hearing from many among the age group that Father describes in this post is that they "didn't understand the Latin!" when they were younger, when the English translation is there in their Missals. Ergo, they have a cheat sheet available. What, therefore, are these people on about?!
I had seen the name, "St. Louis Jesuits," in the missalettes before but I didn't fully realize who they were/are and the awful impact they and their fellow travelers (ie. Haugen and Haas) have had on music in the English speaking sector of the Church until I read the Wikipedia article on them today. The article describes their beginnings, when many parishes began using their music from mimeographed sheets (which I personally remember from my boyhood in the early 1970's). It also mentions the fact that about 80% of the music used in U.S. Catholic hymnals (actually missalettes) comes from them, one of their individual members, or one of their "fellow travelers" (my term in this descriptive summary). It's enough to get your blood pressure up!
The article mentions the attraction that this music has had with the baby-boomer generation but then states that it is "widely dissented from by traditionalists of all ages." Though I was born in 1961, and therefore, technically, a "tail-end" baby-boomer myself, I disown my generational identity and count myself among those "traditionalists of all ages" who strongly "dissent" from the music of the St. Louis Jesuits and their ilk!
St. Louis Jesuits...sounds like a baseball team...
St. Louis Jesuits...sounds like a baseball team...
Since I have been visiting England, I have heard songs in Church I have not heard since 1971. It is SO depressing. I cannot understand this at all.
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