THIS MORNING'S PAPAL MASS IN KENYA: DANCING IS RELIGIOUS EXPRESSION AFRICAN CULTURE UNLIKE IN AMERICA WHERE IT NORMALLY ISN'T
27 comments:
Mark Thomas
said...
Somebody had forgotten to tell tens of millions of our brothers and sisters throughout Africa, where he is beloved by the Faithful, that Pope Francis' Pontificate is "finished".
Such so-called "leading" Traditional Catholic blogs such as Rorate Caeli, who offer supposedly "expert" analysis and commentary, have informed us that Pope Francis is finished as Pope.
Guess what? Rorate Caeli, for example, a blog that has been way, way off the mark numerous times in it's "expert" analysis and commentary, is wrong again.
As they are a "leading" Traditionalist source, I just checked their blog to view their coverage of Pope Francis' Apostolic visit to Africa. During the past couple of days, Rorate Caeli has offered one remark after another on the Russian jet fighter downed by Turkey.
Conversely, Rorate Caeli, as far as I can tell, did not offer one prayer for Pope Francis' safe travel and holy success during his visit to several African nations.
The blog did not report anything about the Pope's visit to Africa...not a word about the massive outpouring of love that he's has received from Africans.
Instead, as far as I'm aware, Rorate Caeli has offered one report on Pope Francis' visit to Africa...this is it:
They offered a photo of a priest holding an umbrella. The cutline reads: "Priest carries umbrella with Pope's words "Who am I to judge?"
I checked additional Traditionalist blogs...not one report, not one prayer, about and for Pope Francis and the tremendous outpouring of love that he's received from Africans.
Oh, well. At least our brothers and sisters in Africa know how to welcome, love, and pray for Pope Francis. I guess that they haven't received the talking points from "leading" Traditionalist blogs...
"BREAKING: CABAL OUSTED POPE BENEDICT XVI, ELECTED POPE FRANCIS...POPE FRANCIS DETERMINED TO 'TRAP' SSPX...POPE FRANCIS IS A COMMUNIST...POPE FRANCIS HATES THE CHURCH...POPE FRANCIS IS NOT THE REAL POPE..."
In the proper spiritual understanding and frame of things, we know that when honor and adore God, and when we do a good works, such as praying and giving alms, we are co-operating with God's grace, which is His a gift to us. We please God when we do what He desires of us. It is to our spiritual benefit when we do what is pleasing to God. His gift of love for us becomes our gift of love back to Him. When we please God it redounds to our benefit and to His honor. Through our spiritual works and actions, the Image and Likeness of God which we are made in, evinces it's pre-eminent purpose and produces its Divinely desired manifestation, and this because our God desires it and has made it so.
There exists a mutual spiritual symbiosis in our right relationship to the Divine Being. Out of His Love for us, He makes necessary and pleasing to Himself that which He doesn't need because He subsists in Himself, but nonetheless desires of us; He likewise makes necessary to us that which we do which is for our spiritual benefit but can only come from us because He desires it, and so He provides to us the necessary grace. We should acknowledge and keep before us that we owe everything to God and so we should show Him honor and gratitude, because it is only through His gifts to us of our bodies and spiritual selves, and His operative grace, that we can do any good at all, and we can only justly give to back to Him the required honor and gratitude due Him by doing what He desires of us, and this by obeying His Holy laws, observing His Just proscriptions, and imitating His Love and Mercy by practicing good works.
A blog, like a magazine, is only as good as those who write for it. It is not necessary to agree with everyone who contributes to it. It is up to the reader to make up his own mind as to the reliability of an article. Many of those who contribute to Rorate have good academic credentials and are well informed, and during the recent synod it was a very useful source of information.
Forty years ago mainstream Catholic journalism was bland and non-controversial, toed the 'spirit of V2' party line, and never criticized the pope. Reading it you would never have believed that the 1970s Church was in virtual freefall.
I think inculturation of the liturgy is a fantastic thing. If in Africa that means dancing, great.
I live in east Kent, just a few miles from the spot where St Augustine, sent by Pope Gregory, landed in Britain to re-ignite the gospel. So to me, local liturgical culture means...a Latin mass, with the Roman canon that St Augustine used when he offered the mass.
Unfortunately, most parishes around here offer the Novus Ordo, a liturgy that was dreamed up by some committee in another country, 40 or 50 years ago.
I believe that "inculturation" of the Liturgy is largely bunk and leads to syncretistic theology, stupid panoramas of local "diversity," fadistic cultural idiocy, theologically irrelevant tribal or clan displays, bad music, invariably awful dancing jigs, and incomprehensible gibberish. The Mass is a Western phenomenon and should remain so. The Church is forming and educating the belief and worship of those she seeks to save...not consulting them.
But, since we are on the subject, I'd like a Mass with Dixie for the Introit, hunting rifles and side arms, a Confederate flag, Bluegrass music, altar girls in Confederate flag bathing suits, a priest in camo, and a pick-up truck print altar cloth, and blackberry wine. Hey, it's my culture...
Yes, Gene, any maybe your old buddy Gene Talamadge railing about those lying Atlanta newspapers---and his friends from the "secret society" who like fire
You mean those Atlanta newspapers were not lying? Since when do newspapers or any media not lie? He was elected Governor 4 times, count 'em, four. Somebody loved him and believed him.
JBS said..."Mark Thomas, Why do you read such blogs? I would guess that fewer than one percent of Catholics follow such blogs, so who cares?"
I read such blogs for the same reason as I read one thing after another (as long as it's not dirty), I enjoy acquiring information. I don't mean the following in nasty fashion, but why should I care that "fewer than one percent of Catholics follow such blogs"?
What I enjoy reading and/or doing is not predicated upon whether that is popular with other people.
By the way, it doesn't matter that fewer than one percent of Catholics may actually visit such blogs as Rorate Caeli. The reality is that Rorate Caeli and additional leading Traditional Catholic blogs reach far more than one percent of Catholics (and non-Catholics).
What leading Traditionalists bloggers have to say is reported, and of course, denounced, by neo-con and liberal bloggers. In turn, Catholics (and non-Catholics) who read those blogs are exposed to that which Traditionalist blogs have offered.
Cardinals, bishops, priests, religious read Traditionalist blogs, even if just to keep tabs on the Traditionalist movement.
Beyond that, national and international news outlets report on Rorate Caeli (and additional blogs that form the Traditional Catholic blogosphere). Via the "mainstream" news media, millions of Catholics (and non-Catholics) are exposed to and influenced by the content of said blogs.
Below are examples from a search that I just conducted on Google News.
To its credit, Rorate Caeli, for example, has positioned itself as the "go-to" Traditionalist blog whenever news media outlets report on the Traditional Catholic community.
The reality is that in many ways, leading Traditional Catholic blogs are the face and voice of Traditional Catholicism. Nobody should underestimate the influence, for better or worse, that leading Traditionalist blogs possess.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
-------------------------------------- Italian journalist: Pope Francis told me 'all the divorced who ask will ...
Lifesite-
The Rorate Caeli blog goes further, however. They argue that the pope's continued relationship with Scalfari, and the fact that the Vatican has ... -----------------------------------------------------
The Tidings-Nov 3, 2015
... “that is the basis of any society changes continuously, as all things change around us,” according to a translation by the blog Rorate Caeli. --------------------------------------------------------------------
Bishop Schneider: The Synod's final report compromises with the ...
Lifesite-Nov 3, 2015
November 3, 2015 (Rorate-Caeli) -- The XIV General Assembly of the Synod of the Bishops (October 4 – 25, 2015), which was dedicated to the ... ------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reformed canonization rite returns
National Catholic Reporter -
The return of the reformed rite is mourned by Rorate Caeli, a traditional Catholic blog, as a reversal of the "reform of the reform" that Pope ... ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pope Francis through Republican eyes: Sound on abortion, dodgy ...
ChristianToday-Sep 24, 2015
The Catholic website Rorate Caeli tweeted after Francis' White House speech: "Not sure if that was a speech by the head of the Catholic ... ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Actor Mark Wahlberg raises eyebrows as host of Philadelphia Pope ...
Jerusalem Post Israel News - Sep 26, 2015
Conservative Catholic blog Rorate Caeli called Wahlberg out for his support of gay marriage, which the Church strongly opposes. Pope Francis ...
I liked it when the "custom" was a Traditional Latin Mass no matter where you were in the world and any Catholic felt at home and could follow along!!!!!! The dancing is delightful if it was not a Roman Catholic Mass, I get it, but it does not belong at a Roman Catholic Mass.
Eugene you only think that you know what I think. I'd like to know what you think about the policeman who shot the young guy in Chicago 16 times, and what you think of the pro-life Christian who shot and killed the people in Colorado Springs.....
Hippies weren't invented...discovered, created until the 60s. Of course, since Jesus could do anything, like time travel, maybe he was the first hippie. I don't know. You don't know.
RE: UGA or Tech? Is there any way they could both lose? I quit watching college and pro football years ago when it became nothing but a gang of tattooed, dread-locked thugs and felons who don't have the IQ or education to be in college, anyway. It is all a sham and a lie. Think of all the money that goes to these morons while bright, ambitious students struggle to find scholarships and loans...but, Rantavious (that is a real name) gets a free ride because he can run.
RE: the shootings you mention...the Colorado guy is obviously a crazy who should not have been loos, anyway. But, liberal policies keep these people on the streets. The Chicago shooting was just another ho-hum...black punk with a record as long as your leg prances around with a knife in front of armed cops and gets blown away. Blame cops. Yawn....
So...here's how it is...when people who are not Christians kill people, it's because they are evil. When people who are Christians kill people, it's because they are insane...not responsible (Bless their hearts.). It's the fault of the liberals for not confining them or curing them.
It's always open season on "ho-hum...black punks"...especially if they "prance". That definitely deserves 16 bullets.
BTW...he was walking away from the cops. The knife had a 3 inch blade which was folded into the handle. I have a Swiss Army knife like that. I bet the police wouldn't shoot me 16 times if they saw me "prancing" with it. I'm too white.
You quit watching college and pro football years ago? What ever led you to watch them in the first place? 99% of the the population was smart enough not to waste time like this. What happened to you? Is this indicative of your character, watching "football" on TV? Sheesh...
27 comments:
Somebody had forgotten to tell tens of millions of our brothers and sisters throughout Africa, where he is beloved by the Faithful, that Pope Francis' Pontificate is "finished".
Such so-called "leading" Traditional Catholic blogs such as Rorate Caeli, who offer supposedly "expert" analysis and commentary, have informed us that Pope Francis is finished as Pope.
http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2015/11/papacy-in-collapse-crisis-of-bergoglio.html
Guess what? Rorate Caeli, for example, a blog that has been way, way off the mark numerous times in it's "expert" analysis and commentary, is wrong again.
As they are a "leading" Traditionalist source, I just checked their blog to view their coverage of Pope Francis' Apostolic visit to Africa. During the past couple of days, Rorate Caeli has offered one remark after another on the Russian jet fighter downed by Turkey.
Conversely, Rorate Caeli, as far as I can tell, did not offer one prayer for Pope Francis' safe travel and holy success during his visit to several African nations.
The blog did not report anything about the Pope's visit to Africa...not a word about the massive outpouring of love that he's has received from Africans.
Instead, as far as I'm aware, Rorate Caeli has offered one report on Pope Francis' visit to Africa...this is it:
They offered a photo of a priest holding an umbrella. The cutline reads: "Priest carries umbrella with Pope's words "Who am I to judge?"
I checked additional Traditionalist blogs...not one report, not one prayer, about and for Pope Francis and the tremendous outpouring of love that he's received from Africans.
Oh, well. At least our brothers and sisters in Africa know how to welcome, love, and pray for Pope Francis. I guess that they haven't received the talking points from "leading" Traditionalist blogs...
"BREAKING: CABAL OUSTED POPE BENEDICT XVI, ELECTED POPE FRANCIS...POPE FRANCIS DETERMINED TO 'TRAP' SSPX...POPE FRANCIS IS A COMMUNIST...POPE FRANCIS HATES THE CHURCH...POPE FRANCIS IS NOT THE REAL POPE..."
Utter nonsense.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
I agree, dancing in America is not usually a religious expression of African culture.
Coming soon to a parish near you. Fr.McD, you may need to move the altar rail to make room for the dancers...
Mark Thomas,
Why do you read such blogs? I would guess that fewer than one percent of Catholics follow such blogs, so who cares?
Always Give Thanks to God
In the proper spiritual understanding and frame of things, we know that when honor and adore God, and when we do a good works, such as praying and giving alms, we are co-operating with God's grace, which is His a gift to us. We please God when we do what He desires of us. It is to our spiritual benefit when we do what is pleasing to God. His gift of love for us becomes our gift of love back to Him. When we please God it redounds to our benefit and to His honor. Through our spiritual works and actions, the Image and Likeness of God which we are made in, evinces it's pre-eminent purpose and produces its Divinely desired manifestation, and this because our God desires it and has made it so.
There exists a mutual spiritual symbiosis in our right relationship to the Divine Being. Out of His Love for us, He makes necessary and pleasing to Himself that which He doesn't need because He subsists in Himself, but nonetheless desires of us; He likewise makes necessary to us that which we do which is for our spiritual benefit but can only come from us because He desires it, and so He provides to us the necessary grace. We should acknowledge and keep before us that we owe everything to God and so we should show Him honor and gratitude, because it is only
through His gifts to us of our bodies and spiritual selves, and His operative grace, that we can do any good at all, and we can only justly give to back to Him the required honor and gratitude due Him by doing what He desires of us, and this by obeying His Holy laws, observing His Just proscriptions, and imitating His Love and Mercy by practicing good works.
George, you're talking like Moses or something. Happy Thanksgiving. Lighten up a little....
Shite,
Dancers worth their salt should be able to utilize the rail just fine.
A blog, like a magazine, is only as good as those who write for it. It is not necessary to agree with everyone who contributes to it. It is up to the reader to make up his own mind as to the reliability of an article. Many of those who contribute to Rorate have good academic credentials and are well informed, and during the recent synod it was a very useful source of information.
Forty years ago mainstream Catholic journalism was bland and non-controversial, toed the 'spirit of V2' party line, and never criticized the pope. Reading it you would never have believed that the 1970s Church was in virtual freefall.
I think inculturation of the liturgy is a fantastic thing. If in Africa that means dancing, great.
I live in east Kent, just a few miles from the spot where St Augustine, sent by Pope Gregory, landed in Britain to re-ignite the gospel. So to me, local liturgical culture means...a Latin mass, with the Roman canon that St Augustine used when he offered the mass.
Unfortunately, most parishes around here offer the Novus Ordo, a liturgy that was dreamed up by some committee in another country, 40 or 50 years ago.
When will my local culture be respected?
Good one, Tony V. Amen
I believe that "inculturation" of the Liturgy is largely bunk and leads to syncretistic theology, stupid panoramas of local "diversity," fadistic cultural idiocy, theologically irrelevant tribal or clan displays, bad music, invariably awful dancing jigs, and incomprehensible gibberish. The Mass is a Western phenomenon and should remain so. The Church is forming and educating the belief and worship of those she seeks to save...not consulting them.
But, since we are on the subject, I'd like a Mass with Dixie for the Introit, hunting rifles and side arms, a Confederate flag, Bluegrass music, altar girls in Confederate flag bathing suits, a priest in camo, and a pick-up truck print altar cloth, and blackberry wine. Hey, it's my culture...
Yes, Gene, any maybe your old buddy Gene Talamadge railing about those lying Atlanta newspapers---and his friends from the "secret society" who like fire
You mean those Atlanta newspapers were not lying? Since when do newspapers or any media not lie? He was elected Governor 4 times, count 'em, four. Somebody loved him and believed him.
Eugene, bluegrass music is country, but not redneck-racist like the rest of the stuff you mention....and you.
There is nothing racist about ANYTHING I mentioned.
JBS said..."Mark Thomas, Why do you read such blogs? I would guess that fewer than one percent of Catholics follow such blogs, so who cares?"
I read such blogs for the same reason as I read one thing after another (as long as it's not dirty), I enjoy acquiring information. I don't mean the following in nasty fashion, but why should I care that "fewer than one percent of Catholics follow such blogs"?
What I enjoy reading and/or doing is not predicated upon whether that is popular with other people.
By the way, it doesn't matter that fewer than one percent of Catholics may actually visit such blogs as Rorate Caeli. The reality is that Rorate Caeli and additional leading Traditional Catholic blogs reach far more than one percent of Catholics (and non-Catholics).
What leading Traditionalists bloggers have to say is reported, and of course, denounced, by neo-con and liberal bloggers. In turn, Catholics (and non-Catholics) who read those blogs are exposed to that which Traditionalist blogs have offered.
Cardinals, bishops, priests, religious read Traditionalist blogs, even if just to keep tabs on the Traditionalist movement.
Beyond that, national and international news outlets report on Rorate Caeli (and additional blogs that form the Traditional Catholic blogosphere). Via the "mainstream" news media, millions of Catholics (and non-Catholics) are exposed to and influenced by the content of said blogs.
Below are examples from a search that I just conducted on Google News.
To its credit, Rorate Caeli, for example, has positioned itself as the "go-to" Traditionalist blog whenever news media outlets report on the Traditional Catholic community.
The reality is that in many ways, leading Traditional Catholic blogs are the face and voice of Traditional Catholicism. Nobody should underestimate the influence, for better or worse, that leading Traditionalist blogs possess.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
--------------------------------------
Italian journalist: Pope Francis told me 'all the divorced who ask will ...
Lifesite-
The Rorate Caeli blog goes further, however. They argue that the pope's continued relationship with Scalfari, and the fact that the Vatican has ...
-----------------------------------------------------
The Tidings-Nov 3, 2015
... “that is the basis of any society changes continuously, as all things change around us,” according to a translation by the blog Rorate Caeli.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Bishop Schneider: The Synod's final report compromises with the ...
Lifesite-Nov 3, 2015
November 3, 2015 (Rorate-Caeli) -- The XIV General Assembly of the Synod of the Bishops (October 4 – 25, 2015), which was dedicated to the ...
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reformed canonization rite returns
National Catholic Reporter -
The return of the reformed rite is mourned by Rorate Caeli, a traditional Catholic blog, as a reversal of the "reform of the reform" that Pope ...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pope Francis through Republican eyes: Sound on abortion, dodgy ...
ChristianToday-Sep 24, 2015
The Catholic website Rorate Caeli tweeted after Francis' White House speech: "Not sure if that was a speech by the head of the Catholic ...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Actor Mark Wahlberg raises eyebrows as host of Philadelphia Pope ...
Jerusalem Post Israel News - Sep 26, 2015
Conservative Catholic blog Rorate Caeli called Wahlberg out for his support of gay marriage, which the Church strongly opposes. Pope Francis ...
I liked it when the "custom" was a Traditional Latin Mass no matter where you were in the world and any Catholic felt at home and could follow along!!!!!! The dancing is delightful if it was not a Roman Catholic Mass, I get it, but it does not belong at a Roman Catholic Mass.
Anon 5:23....You probably think that Jesus was a European Caucasian. He was not.
Gob thinks Jesus was a hippie.
Eugene you only think that you know what I think. I'd like to know what you think about the policeman who shot the young guy in Chicago 16 times, and what you think of the pro-life Christian who shot and killed the people in Colorado Springs.....
Hippies weren't invented...discovered, created until the 60s. Of course, since Jesus could do anything, like time travel, maybe he was the first hippie. I don't know. You don't know.
Do you want UGA or Ga.Tech?
RE: UGA or Tech? Is there any way they could both lose? I quit watching college and pro football years ago when it became nothing but a gang of tattooed, dread-locked thugs and felons who don't have the IQ or education to be in college, anyway. It is all a sham and a lie. Think of all the money that goes to these morons while bright, ambitious students struggle to find scholarships and loans...but, Rantavious (that is a real name) gets a free ride because he can run.
RE: the shootings you mention...the Colorado guy is obviously a crazy who should not have been loos, anyway. But, liberal policies keep these people on the streets. The Chicago shooting was just another ho-hum...black punk with a record as long as your leg prances around with a knife in front of armed cops and gets blown away. Blame cops. Yawn....
So...here's how it is...when people who are not Christians kill people, it's because they are evil. When people who are Christians kill people, it's because they are insane...not responsible (Bless their hearts.). It's the fault of the liberals for not confining them or curing them.
It's always open season on "ho-hum...black punks"...especially if they "prance". That definitely deserves 16 bullets.
BTW...he was walking away from the cops. The knife had a 3 inch blade which was folded into the handle. I have a Swiss Army knife like that. I bet the police wouldn't shoot me 16 times if they saw me "prancing" with it. I'm too white.
Ya' know, Gob, it is really a shame that the cops would not shoot you 16 times...LOL!
You quit watching college and pro football years ago? What ever led you to watch them in the first place? 99% of the the population was smart enough not to waste time like this. What happened to you? Is this indicative of your character, watching "football" on TV? Sheesh...
Well, Anonymous @ 8:44...it must have been a weakness...
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