I wonder, now, if someone in the Vatican and very high up did not assist the producer of the movie, "Francesco" to further the LGBTQ, etc., agenda in the Vatican and to do so subversively.
I just learned this:
In a 2019 interview on Mexican television, he was asked about his opposition to gay marriage in Argentina and his openness to LGBT people as pope.
“I have always defended doctrine,” he said. “It is a contradiction to speak of homosexual marriage.”
AP is reporting this ditty:
Questions swirled Thursday about the origins of Pope Francis’s bombshell comments endorsing same-sex civil unions, with all evidence suggesting he made them in a 2019 interview that was never broadcast in its entirety.
The Vatican refused to comment on whether it cut the remarks from its
own broadcast or if the Mexican broadcaster that conducted the
interview did. And it didn’t respond to questions about why it allowed
the comments to be aired now in the documentary “Francesco,” which
premiered Wednesday...
One of Francis’ top communications advisers, Father Antonio Spadaro, insisted the pope’s comments were old news, saying they were made during a May 2019 interview with Mexican broadcaster Televisa.
“There’s nothing new because it’s a part of that interview,” Spadaro told The Associated Press as he exited the premiere. “It seems strange that you don’t remember.”
In fact, the pope's comments on same sex "civil unions" was excised from the video and any written texts about it. There was a cleansing in other words, a back-tracking.
But Afineevsky was given the original video and text and he used it for ideological purposes and enabled by someone at the Vatican, perhaps someone in the Vatican's gay lobby????
Afineevsky, who is gay, had expressed surprise after the premiere that the pope’s comments had created such a stir, saying Francis wasn’t trying to change doctrine but was merely expressing his belief gay people should enjoy the same rights as heterosexuals.
But Televisa didn’t air those comments when it broadcast the interview — nor did the Vatican when it put out its recordings of it. The broadcaster has not commented on the intrigue.
Here's the video proof:
26 comments:
Father McDonald, thank you for your post.
The great Catholic blog, Where Peter Is, also discussed the video editing issue.
(Your blog, as well as Where Peter Is, are two go-to, must-read blogs.)
-- Those Pope Francis quotes: Video editing and media controversy
https://wherepeteris.com/those-pope-francis-quotes-video-editing-and-media-controversy-2/
Father McDonald, thank you for having posted the side-by-side video comparison of the Pope's May 2019 A.D. interview, as compared to the video that was shown yesterday.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
"The Holy Father’s recent comments on the passage of a law for civil unions for homosexual persons reflect his pastoral approach to persons who may be on the peripheries of society.
"His comments in no way signal a departure from the teaching of the Catholic Church concerning marriage or homosexuality."
— Bishop Zubik, Diocese of Pittsburg.
I much prefer Bishop Tobin's comments calling for clarification. It shows Bishop Tobin to be someone who is capable of critical thinking.....unlike some on this blog who swoon at Pope Francis' every word and defend every action.
Father McDonald made it clear that the language used in the law specifically states "marriage" when refering to homosexual civil unions and Pope Francis should know this and should in fact clarify his remarks.
“The only thing I fear is bad Catholics.”-St. Bernadette
This statement is truer with each passing day
Canonist Edward Peters agreed with Pope Francis in regard to "same-sex unions."
https://canonlawblog.wordpress.com/2017/09/13/same-sex-marriage-and-same-sex-unions-are-not-the-same-things/
In the Light of the Law A Canon Lawyer's Blog
September 13, 2017 A.D.
Excerpt:
‘Same-sex marriage’ and ‘same-sex unions’ are not the same things…
… and I think Pope Francis was right to make that observation, which in turn means, yes, I think that the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith muffed the distinction between “unions” and “marriage” back in 2003 when it published its otherwise insightful “Considerations regarding proposals to give legal recognition to unions between homosexual persons”.
I argued that ‘same-sex marriage’ and ‘same-sex unions’ were distinguishable phenomena, and that CDF was wrong to require Catholics to oppose legal recognition of ‘same-sex unions’ with the same non-negotiable vigor as Catholics must reject legal recognition of ‘same-sex marriage’, in an essay penned more than two years ago but which, along with essays by many others, is still making its slow way through the world of printed book production.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
Oh my gosh! CANONIST ED PETERS AGREES WITH THE POPE! WOW! THE POPE MUST BE RIGHT!
Mark. Go drink your Ovaltine and go to bed. Your bandwagon drooling isn't helping this conversation. I'll be sure to save the Bergoglio edition of Tiger Beat and mail it to you.
Now go snuggle with your "Our Lady of Perpetual Paganism" pachamama doll.
Pax,
Uncle Jorge
Bishop Tobin walked back his dreadful tweet from yesterday. His tone changed considerably from yesterday.
Today, Bishop Tobin said:
"In the wake of yesterday’s debate, and to be clear, please know that I have filial respect and personal affection for Pope Francis, as we all should have.
"He is the Vicar of Christ and our spiritual father!
"But a candid discussion of key issues is always good for the Church."
A candid discussion of key issues is fine. But it is not fine to declare that the Vicar of Christ stands in opposition to Holy Mother Church's teachings.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
Blogger Fr Martin Fox said...
Mark Thomas:
Please reconcile Pope Francis' endorsement of "civil unions" for people sexually attracted to their same sex, with the CDF's statement:
Legal recognition of homosexual unions or placing them on the same level as marriage would mean not only the approval of deviant behavior, with the consequence of making it a model in present-day society, but would also obscure basic values which belong to the common inheritance of humanity. The Church cannot fail to defend these values, for the good of men and women and for the good of society itself...
The Congregation on the Doctrine of the Faith added, calling support for such unions from politicians “gravely immoral.”
Not even in a remote analogous sense do homosexual unions fulfil the purpose for which marriage and family deserve specific categorical recognition. On the contrary, there are good reasons for holding that such unions are harmful to the proper development of human society, especially if their impact on society were to increase....
October 22, 2020 at 6:00 PM
Remember that high school kid in the red maga cap? Its the same thing.
Is it Demark...or Denmark?
The professor of politics and author of 14 books, Dennis Altman, a homosexual and pioneer of gay rights, described the gay marriage campaign thus: “.....it is such self indulgent rubbish.....I mean people around the world are still being jailed and or tortured and even killed for being homosexual.....and people here are carrying on as if gays not being allowed to marry is a huge abuse of civil rights.”
Stefano Gabbana and Domenic Dolce, founders of a luxury fashion house/brand, are both openly homosexual and in 2015 stated in an interview : “...the family is not a fad......in it, there is a supernatural sense of belonging. We didn’t invent the family ourselves and children have a right to be raised by a mother and father.”. They went on to condemn IVF and spoke against same sex couples seeking to have a child either by adoption or using “wombs for rent”....... “We as a gay couple say children should have a father and mother.”
A contributor to Fr Z’s blog wrote: The above comments drew the ire of Elton John who in retaliation (vendetta ?) instructed all people to boycott Dolce and Gabbana.
And also wrote, why do these and some other homosexuals GET IT while certain Catholic clergy like Fr James Martin do NOT get it ?
I read this today from an “exclusive” in “The Australian” by the journalist Dennis Shanahan :
The Vatican’s ambassador to Australia, Bishop Adolfo Tito Yllana has tested positive to the coronavirus in Canberra, Australia, less than 14 days after a private, face to face netting with Pope Francis in the Vatican.
The meeting, at the Pope’s request, took place within the 2 week infectious period for COVID-19 and the Australian government has warned the Holy See of the infection.
Bishop Yllana was recently called to Rome to see the Pope in relation to allegations about mystery transfers of money (more than 2 million dollars, double what has been reported in The Times, in London, between Feb 2017 and June 2018) from the Vatican secretariat to Australia, allegedly to adversely effect the child sex abuse trial of Cardinal George Pell.
This newspaper revealed yesterday that anti-corruption authorities in Victoria, Australia, will be looking into large amounts of money wired from the Vatican to Australia, allegedly connected to Cardinal Pell’s past trials, after receiving information from the Australian Federal Police.
AUSTREC Australia’s financial intelligence agency (that is usually kept busy investigating money transfers and money laundering by criminal organisations involved in drug dealing, child pornography etc or by terrorist groups) has this week confirmed it has passed information it has gathered about mysterious transfers of money to Australia from the Vatican to the Australian Federal Police and Victorian Police for further investigation.
What could these investigations reveal?
PJK.
"A candid discussion of key issues is fine. But it is not fine to declare that the Vicar of Christ stands in opposition to Holy Mother Church's teachings."
Except when he does.
No Catholic wants to believe that we have a pope who collides with the Deposit of Faith. But we can only do the mental back-flips so much until we have to wake up and admit reality. The Permanent Instruction of the Alta Vendita has been fulfilled in the person of Pope Bergoglio. What an insult to St. Francis of Assisi to cop his name for this embarrassing pontificate.
I am not saying we should hate the pope. I encourage everyone to pray for this pope. I also encourage everyone to follow their Catholic brains.
If one of the worst things that can happen to Catholics in our nation is to be pained by the latest reporting of something Francis has said, or the latest about financial corruption in the Vatican or something said by Fr James Martin etc consider :
“JOS, Nigeria (Morning Star News), Muslim Fulani herdsmen in north-central Nigeria hacked a young Catholic man to death with machetes last Wednesday. One of 8 Christians killed this past month in Plateau state.”
The Vatican is festering with sexual, financial and moral corruption which includes the Vatican’s appeasement of China, throwing the underground Church under the rickshaw and silence on Chinese religious oppression, Islamic persecution of Christians and the like. It is a mess!
Deutsche Welle is reporting on this too re Australian police investigating alleged Becciu bribes to men who have accused Cardinal Pell of sexual assaults.
Australian journalist, Andrew Bolt, has a number of times stated that, all up, 27 men over a period of time came forward to police with accusations against Pell but most of them were so far-fetched, so incredible and at times impossible ( eg Cardinal Pell being interstate or overseas when the alleged offences occurred) that even the VERY anti-Pell Victorian police and department of prosecution knew they could never be taken to court; and those that did go to court all failed except one; and Pell was eventually cleared of that one on appeal by a 7 to 0 vote in Australia’s highest court, after over a year in prison.
What are the possible reasons Cardinal Becciu (and others?) might have wanted large amounts of Vatican $$ sent to Melbourne, Australia, in ways that have aroused such suspicion?
To assist the homeless in Melbourne? Cardinal Becciu has a relative in Melbourne whose business needs a “non repayable loan”?
To provide financial aid to any man willing to go to police with allegations against Cardinal Pell, who in his job then at the Vatican could have discovered (among MUCH else) for example, how many “non repayable loans” had been given to Becciu’s family members ?
Without doubt Pell had serious enemies in the Vatican.
Could those enemies have stooped so low to spend a lot of Church money to have an honest man, innocent of sexual assault, found guilty and sent tp prison, where he easily could have died before release?
Ask yourself, could the Pope run on the Democratic platform for President or Governor of California or the Mayor of San Francisco?
Mark Thomas said..."I have found the past few hours on Twitter that one Spanish speaker after another noted that Pope Francis employed the words 'convivencia civil.' The Spanish speakers in question said that 'convivencia civil' does not mean 'homosexual unions' in Spanish. 'Convivencia civil' means 'civil coexistence' in Spanish."
Archbishop Victor Fernandez:
But Fernández, Archbishop of La Plata, Argentina, said Wednesday that the pope’s term connotes a civil union as the term is commonly understood.
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/argentine-archbishop-and-pope-francis-advisor-says-civil-union-not-mistranslated-in-documentary-95995
Mark Thomas apparently ignored Father Fox's post and will continue to try and find excuses for The Popes abhorrent proclamation.
Looking for a way to twist and defend the Popes words no matter what language is not going to change the fact that he said it and supports civil unions.
Fall on your sword Mark Thomas....its over........
I hope John Nolan’s earlier remarks bare out. It never occured to me that this is possible retribution for actions against corruption. That seems at least plausible.
PJK,
Yes, it is often amazing how quickly these stories develop! The “Godfather-like” Vatican cash trail is now a very real drama. Only 3 weeks ago there was unsubstantiated Hollywood-style Godfather film talk ; conspiracy theory stuff. Now there is “actionable financial intelligence of serious crime” and Australian federal and state authorities are now under increasing pressure to resolve the twin issues of the transfer of murky millions and allegations raised during Vatican investigations that Cardinal Pell’s prosecution was perverted. No fewer than 4 investigating agencies, including an international financial transfer watchdog, are involved in examining suspicious money transfers from the Vatican to Australia. Already 2 Italian newspapers have reported that Vatican investigators have been told money was sent to Australia to help the case against Cardinal Pell. It is very significant that Information from AUSTRAC and the Australian Federal Police has been passed to IBAC, an anti-corruption body set up to identify and prevent serious corrupt conduct across the whole public sector - which includes police, the judiciary and even members of parliament.
In the novel “Three Cheers for the Paraclete” an elderly bishop states:
I detest this sort of embarrassment! Any hint the church is so economically entrenched and any hint of financial scandals. My father was a simple tradesman, a French polisher, and I can tell you he was far more genuinely shocked by any hint of financial improprieties in the Church than he was by a dozen apostasies!
The question is - is the pope intent on creating confusion and disorder, or is the pope merely a poor communicator of the Faith? Although the results of either, tragically, might be the same, intent is sinister; ineptness is, well, to quote the phrase 'au current' "he was born that way".
Those who try to defend the Pope by pointing to the fact that civil unions are not marriage and that for that reason Francis didn't surrerder Catholic doctrine are very wrong because the question of civil gay unions is really a matter of the natural law, not of revealed doctrine.
It is by the natural law that homosexual acts are categorized as perverse and contrary to human nature. And from this it follows that there is no wiggle room at all for civil gay unions. All people, whether they accept divine revelation or not, are bound by the law of natural reason to reject homosexuality in all its forms, and therefore civil gay unions cannot exist. A law that it contrary to the prohibitions of the natural law has no legitimacy whatsoever, because it implies a contradiction. A law which goes against reason is a law which goes against the idea of law itself.
I agree. I think those pope, typical of the 1970’s social justice warriors and the touchy-feely pastoral theology, prefers an ideology of appeasement and enablement over natural law or any law. We’ve seen already his disdain for law calling those who hold to it doctors of the law.
It is a said state of affairs that secular movements and ideologies are guiding this pope on several levels. We need to pray for him to take his papal office seriously and to do it in the most humble way possible. There is nothing humble about this pope.
All it takes is preception to make things fall down hill. If the Pope had any credibility left, I'd say he lost it...
It is unfortunate that the last conclave looked to PF Italian ancestry instead of the unstable environment in which he functioned since he was born. While there are certainly prudent and critical thinking clergy in Central and South America, the region is also well known for seeking leftist secular answers to religious and moral questions. Of course, in the interim we should remind ourselves that in the end the Church always survives.
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