9. The Democrats and Republicans will have conventions
8. The state of Georgia will continue to have two dioceses
7. Saint Joseph Church in Macon will still be referred to as a Cathedral
6. Catholics will come home and Anglicans will come home
5. Southern Orders will continue to go worldwide and Italians will catch on
4. There will be an EF wedding and an EF Requiem and and EF Solemnity at St. Joseph
3. There will be an EF weekly at St. Joseph and an EF High Mass monthly
2. Pope Benedict will mandate kneeling for Holy Communion and the Benedictine Altar arrangement, but not mandate ad orientem, simply allow to a stable group who wants it
1. The world will not end on Fr. McDonald's birthday, 12/21/12
21 comments:
Wow, Father, you're way out on a limb there, aren't you? With the exception of #2, all seem pretty certain. I do pray your list will be a clean sweep.
In terms of Templar the future question for the Requiem will be what position will he take at this Mass, sitting, standing, kneeling or prostrate on his back? :) "Twilight Zone" anyone?
You forgot to mention that "Serutan" is "Natures" spelled backwards--oh wait! That's for the "Believe It Or Not" list.
In regard to #2, I don't understand that any action by the Pope is required to allow ad orientem celebration of Mass. When it's already fully allowed, what could the Pope do to allow it more?
Henry, what Fr. wrote was mandate not allow. In my Archdiocese, a mandate will be needed, I'm afraid.
Bill, my question was in regard to the prediction that Pope Benedict would mandate kneeling, but would "simply allow ad orientem celebration for a stable group who wants it".
My experience would indicate that mandating ad orientem would be required for any change to occur, that merely "allowing" something that's already allowed would have no effect most places. No more than merely allowing the EF produces it whenever and wherever it's desired.
Henry, I think bishops would have to be involved either to approve, disapprove or say nothing if a priest decided to go ad orientem. What would be disastrous is if each priest could decide for himself, thus the Mass being celebrated one way one Mass and another way another Mass depending on the priest or the bishop. The same though is true for the EF Mass, a priest could technically celebrate it facing the people. Should that be solely his choice?
Fr. McDonald, it surely would be rash and precipitous for an individual priest to suddenly "go ad orientem" for all his Masses. And it would be simply stupid for him to do so against the disapproval of his bishop.
However, I suspect that many bishops would have no problem with local experimentation with isolated ad orientem celebrations to test the water--perhaps starting with an occasional week day or an occasional special Mass--and then careful parish discussion and discernment, such as Fr. Newman conducted in Greenville, leading to general parish approval, perhaps starting with a single ad orientem Sunday Mass in the parish.
In regard to versus populum celebration of the EF, the considerations are no different, except for immemorial custom, which some theologians say carries greater weight than mere "norms".
Incidentally, although I personally believe that versus populum has contributed more than any other single factor to what Card. Ratzinger described as the "disintegration of the liturgy", I think (as I gather Pope Benedict does), that it would also be precipitous for the pope to suddenly mandate ad orientem at the present time. The constructive question is what the Pope can do to effectively encourage ad orientem short of mandating it.
Sorry, Henry, for misreading your comment.
Fr., with respect, it seems to me that we already have a disaster in which each priest, or at least each parish, shapes its own celebration of the Mass. At least, that is what the evidence in the parishes I have sampled here would suggest.
Father, hopefully not all in 2012, but at sometime in my life I plan on adopting all of those positions at a Requiem Mass. For 2012 I'm hoping to confine my options to the first 3 postures.
I agree with everything Henry has contributed to this conversation. I would go further and say that the Holy Father has been exhibiting ad orientem Masses with his altar arrangements. Moreover, Fr. McDonald followed his lead to a certain extent by placing a Crucifix on our table altar at St. Joseph. (I wonder whether Father sought the bishop's permission for doing so...?)
I think that merely placing the six candles on the table altar would be very close to "fixing" this particular problem with the Novus Ordo. The Holy Father has modeled that method and presumably Fr. McDonald could institute that fix without the bishop's permission and likely without ruffling too many feathers in the parish. Additionally, that arrangement works quite well for these table altars as it is somewhat strange to see the Mass offered with the priest facing away from the people at the table altar anyway.
I guess the basic question is whether ad orientem always means literally facing away from the people or if the "barrier" between the priest and people (as conceived by the Holy Father in his Masses) is enough. I think at St. Joseph, the placement of the candles on the altar would be enough and would work very well with the existing architecture. So, until the awful table altars are removed, perhaps that is the way to go... I recall this set up was used at one Mass last year for a special occasion and I was giddy when I walked into the Church in hopes that it would be the new norm in our parish.
Henry, at Holy Ghost in Knoxville, I really like how the table altar went unused at the EF Mass I attended while on vacation. It was quite nice (although awkward for the priest and servers, it seemed) for the old High Altar to be used.
I agree, Marc, that the Benedictine arrangement may serve to provide some sort of "barrier", or perhaps more generally some sense of "distance", whether physical or liturgical, between the nave and the altar in the sanctuary. In this regard, I've always thought the actual distance between the altar and the faithful in the Roman basilicas, particularly St. Peter's Basilica, provides adequate separation to make the actual orientation of the altar not seem critical.
As for Holy Ghost Church, I'm not sure the priest and servers find the presence of the table altar that awkward. It occurs to me that it may actually serve somewhat as that "barrier", like a partial iconostasis in Eastern churches, or a rood screen in old English churches, though hardly as effective as the floor to ceiling curtain that in ancient Roman churches was drawn between people and altar at the start of the Canon, so as to shield the sacred rites from profane eyes.
I personally do not like the Benedictine altar arrangment when facing the people if the candlesticks and crucifix are to tall and block the view of the Sacrifice. There is no such barrier with this style of altar when the Mass is ad orientem. I much prefer two other possible style for this when Mass is facing the people, that the six candle sticks be behind the altar but high up and large and that only two candlesticks be on the altar with a short crucifix for the priest. Or all six candles and crucifix could be on the altar but short not tall.
Our solution at St. Joseph Church is a combination of both. Our new altar is the same level as the mensa of the old high altar which is now a reredos. From the congregation's point of view the two are integral. Thus the six candlesticks and the crurcifix are on the reredos and behind the priest when facing the people and then there are four magnificent and tall floor candlesticks flanking the new altar but no candles on the altar itself and a small crucifix on the altar facing the priest. But when I celebrate the EF ad orientem, the view from the congregation is that the altar and reredos are a unit, just look at the picture in the post about top down decisions and you will see this or pictures in posts below this for the requiem Mass and facing or not facing the congregation.
Blocking the view of the sacrifice is "I think" the purpose behind Pope Benedicts Altar arrangement. In an EF Mass one doe not see the sacrifice until the Elevation, which is the same effect of the blocking by the Candles in the OF.
As I have said many times before, I am painfully aware that I should not be looking at the Priest during Mass, it's not "his show", but despite that I do it all the time. Humans are drawn to eye contact. That's why Ad orientem is superior posture, because I am not distracted by the Priest.
The Benedictine altar arrangement is clearly intended to "hide" the sacrifice. As far as I know, that has always been the tradition in the Church (as Henry pointed out by references to historical architecture and Templar pointed out by reference to distraction in the current set up). This is also why there is a prominent Crucifix at the altar... so we can focus on the Sacrifice, not by watching the priest in persona Christi, but by meditating on the Victim.
Frankly, I would ask priests (somewhat hyperbolically) to please stop talking to the laity and distracting us during the Mass while we're trying to pray!
:-)
I agree with Meyer. There is far too much variation from parish to parish in how the OF is celebrated by various Priests.
pin, you've been unusually subdued lately.
Is this a New Year's Resolution, or has Father had to delete your comments yet again?
LOL
~SqueekerLamb
Squeeker, No New Year's vows of silence for me. Much of the discussion lately has been on liturgy and the history of liturgy. I am not a liturgist and have not studied liturgy very much so I do not really feel qualified to comment. Theology and Church history are more my thing and, of course, dogging Ignotus (LOL).
Remarkably, Fr. has not had to delete but a handful of my posts on the blog, and some of those were just tasteless jokes...
I never really understood the whole "blocking" of the Sacrifice. Just to catch a glimpse of Father's hands was always more than sufficient for me. Bells signify what is happening and anyone who knows about the basics of Mass should know what is happening. Directly in front of you is often someone's head. If you sit in all but the first few pews you can not really see much anyways. I find it hard to imagine a candlestick so wide that the Priest and his hands are hidden behind the staff of the stick as if it were a tree. In fact the taller the candlestick and crucifix, the better. This way the the top and widest portion, of course depending on design, is high above the Priest. At the same time elevating one's gaze upwards from where Christ decends onto the Altar. If one chooses to add figurative imagery to the action. I agree that mandates help, but one problem is that there are already so many of them. I think better is to choose something, a document, a Constitution, an Encyclical from the past, by a previous Pope and re issue it. Perhaps adding an adendum from the current Pope. This means minimal "new" papers, insures continuity with the past, brings former Popes into the modern age and at the same time educates folk about our history and how papal documents are relevant today. It just strengthens the position that as much as She changes, the Church is always the same. By re-emphasizing and bringing the past into today by using original sources is a lesson in history. Imagine if the Papacy were to do this and we hear in every opening line, "As Pope Adrian (whichever Pope) stated on Ad Orientem I wish to reiterate", etc ! People today would know that this is not some new announcement or experiment, and at the same time learn we had a Pope named Adrian. Some will dig into that, learn about the announcement and a previous Magesterium at the same time.
Rereading this...I finally caught on that you placed kneeling for Holy Communion as more important that the presidential election in the USA.
Moreover, you placed the presidential election as the least important.
(...but not non-important. After all it did make your top ten list).
I'm certain it was no accident on your part.
~SqueekerLamb
It has gotten to the point where changing Presidents is like changing bridge officers on the Titanic...
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