IS IT TRUE OR HYPERBOLE THAT ORDINARY FORM PARISHES AND MASS HAVE NO YOUNG FAMILIES AND NOT MANY CHILDREN?
If it is, someone did not tell my parish, Saint Anne Church in Richmond Hill, Georgia. Our CCD classes (Sunday School) resumed on September 12th. It’s great to see so many smiling faces…
I travel a lot throughout the United States. When in the South, I see more people at Sunday Mass and there are more children than I see at Mass in the Midwest, West or Northeast (with the exception of EF Masses). I suspect that is because Southerners tend to be more traditional than the rest of the US. My former parish, with a parish grade school that is filled, has very few children at Sunday Mass and the congregation is overwhelmingly grey hairs.
Agree with John and TJM. The better question is which is more successful at retention. My suspicion is the EF. I have nothing to back that up other than Fr. Z's assertion that "Tradition if for the young!". The photos of college campus TLM's, major TLM's in the U.S. and exploding seminaries leads me to conclude that he must be right.
If the photos were meant to show how young and vibrant the parish is, they do not accomplish that. The photo with all the children assembled around the altar shows about 40 children in a church building that can house 1000 people.
How many families do those 40 children represent? How many of those children are siblings?
If a parish is big enough, it is naturally going to have a number of young children, but if the families are comprised of just 2 or 3 children on average, and the number 40 can be had in a photo merely because the parish is large, then that's still an indictment against modern Catholics, clergy and laity alike, and is proof of a decaying Church.
In "the old days," many families were huge, and photos such as the ones posted would include 10 times the number of children for a church building that size.
And, like the others have stated, whether they retain the Faith remains to be seen. The statistics tell us that the likelihood is very low that they will.
And no one seems to care all that much.
When Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi were youngsters, photos of that era show packed churches with hundreds of children. Little good it has done them.
The attendance at Sunday Mass in Canada, 99 % Novus Ordo; varies between 2 and 12%,depending on who you listen to.Regardless, the grey hair brigade is in charge almost universally .Kids do attend Catholic schools, but only a handful attend Mass.Most kids are lost when asked to talk about their faith, or recite an Our Father or Hail Mary.
Pope Benedict's intention was not to have 'OF parishes' and 'EF parishes', but for the older rite to take its place alongside the newer one and be given 'parity of esteem'. This was what the late Michael Davies was asking for - no more, no less.
At a press conference in London in 2008 Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos, then the president of Ecclesia Dei, was asked if Benedict envisaged the EF being celebrated in most parishes. He replied 'not in most parishes, in all parishes'. This was hardly a practical proposition, but I have noticed that in parishes that offer both forms there is no sense of apartheid; although the EF Mass will draw people in from a wider radius, the same can be said for an OF Sung Latin Mass, or indeed an English Mass done reverently.
Complete agreement. In my two parishes were both were/are celebrated there is mutual appreciation. In my former parish in Macon I eventually moved our once a month Sunday EF High Mass away from a special 2 pm time to our ordinary form 12:10 pm time which I had made ad orientem four years earlier. No one complained! And I think most thought the only difference was the use of Latin. If I had remained there I would have made that time slot exclusively the EF Mass. I think problems occur when this Mass is foisted onto a congregation’s normal vernacular Mass and told to like it or lump it. But problems occur here in the US when an English Mass is made Spanish and Hispanics out number once Anglo majority parishes.
9 comments:
Father McDonald,
I travel a lot throughout the United States. When in the South, I see more people at Sunday Mass and there are more children than I see at Mass in the Midwest, West or Northeast (with the exception of EF Masses). I suspect that is because Southerners tend to be more traditional than the rest of the US. My former parish, with a parish grade school that is filled, has very few children at Sunday Mass and the congregation is overwhelmingly grey hairs.
The post confirmation drop-off is more serious. Will they come back latter?
Agree with John and TJM. The better question is which is more successful at retention. My suspicion is the EF. I have nothing to back that up other than Fr. Z's assertion that "Tradition if for the young!". The photos of college campus TLM's, major TLM's in the U.S. and exploding seminaries leads me to conclude that he must be right.
John,
If Vatican II had been a success we would be building a lot more parishes and schools than the numbers of parishes and schools that are closing
Father:
If the photos were meant to show how young and vibrant the parish is, they do not accomplish that. The photo with all the children assembled around the altar shows about 40 children in a church building that can house 1000 people.
How many families do those 40 children represent? How many of those children are siblings?
If a parish is big enough, it is naturally going to have a number of young children, but if the families are comprised of just 2 or 3 children on average, and the number 40 can be had in a photo merely because the parish is large, then that's still an indictment against modern Catholics, clergy and laity alike, and is proof of a decaying Church.
In "the old days," many families were huge, and photos such as the ones posted would include 10 times the number of children for a church building that size.
And, like the others have stated, whether they retain the Faith remains to be seen. The statistics tell us that the likelihood is very low that they will.
And no one seems to care all that much.
When Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi were youngsters, photos of that era show packed churches with hundreds of children. Little good it has done them.
Father,
The attendance at Sunday Mass in Canada, 99 % Novus Ordo; varies between 2 and 12%,depending on who you listen to.Regardless, the grey hair brigade is in charge almost universally .Kids do attend Catholic schools, but only a handful attend Mass.Most kids are lost when asked to talk about their faith, or recite an Our Father or Hail Mary.
Pope Benedict's intention was not to have 'OF parishes' and 'EF parishes', but for the older rite to take its place alongside the newer one and be given 'parity of esteem'. This was what the late Michael Davies was asking for - no more, no less.
At a press conference in London in 2008 Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos, then the president of Ecclesia Dei, was asked if Benedict envisaged the EF being celebrated in most parishes. He replied 'not in most parishes, in all parishes'. This was hardly a practical proposition, but I have noticed that in parishes that offer both forms there is no sense of apartheid; although the EF Mass will draw people in from a wider radius, the same can be said for an OF Sung Latin Mass, or indeed an English Mass done reverently.
Complete agreement. In my two parishes were both were/are celebrated there is mutual appreciation. In my former parish in Macon I eventually moved our once a month Sunday EF High Mass away from a special 2 pm time to our ordinary form 12:10 pm time which I had made ad orientem four years earlier. No one complained! And I think most thought the only difference was the use of Latin. If I had remained there I would have made that time slot exclusively the EF Mass.
I think problems occur when this Mass is foisted onto a congregation’s normal vernacular Mass and told to like it or lump it. But problems occur here in the US when an English Mass is made Spanish and Hispanics out number once Anglo majority parishes.
Father McDonald,
I agree with what you have stated but we were told to like it or lump it in the 1960s when the vernacular became the norm
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