tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post886788885187074953..comments2024-03-28T20:30:10.681-04:00Comments on southern orders: POPE FRANCIS CELEBRATES THE SOLEMNITY OF THE PURIFICATION OF THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY PRESENTING THE CHILD JESUS IN THE TEMPLE ACCORDING TO MOSAIC LAW. TRADITIONALLY AT ST. PETER'S THIS MASS IS FOR RELIGOUS MEN AND WOMEN. IT IS ALSO CALLED CANDLEMAS. IN THE USA IT IS CALLED GROUND HOG DAYFr. Allan J. McDonaldhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16986575955114152639noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-52939339212707336392016-02-08T11:29:11.632-05:002016-02-08T11:29:11.632-05:00Anonymous, the Church teaches us that baptism is n...Anonymous, the Church teaches us that baptism is necessary for salvation. Delaying baptism so that more people can be present to "celebrate" the child's baptism is grave matter (I'm not sure how having more people come to celebrate differs from planning a party). The traditional understanding is that delaying baptism beyond 14 days without a sufficient reason is a grave sin.<br /><br />If your priests aren't teaching you this and practicing in accordance with it, then your priests are wrong.Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-45538610449355760202016-02-05T12:19:24.550-05:002016-02-05T12:19:24.550-05:00I also attend a Traditional parish. In it, the pa...I also attend a Traditional parish. In it, the parents who schedule a baptism when family and friends can be present commit no "grave sin." It's not about "planning a party" - it is about having the child's family present we celebrate his/her Baptism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-46930680828905171132016-02-03T19:35:08.445-05:002016-02-03T19:35:08.445-05:00Anonymous, what you describe is not the case in tr...Anonymous, what you describe is not the case in traditional parishes where the Churching is done. In traditional parishes, babies are baptized within a few days. Traditional Catholics still believe in limbo of the infants, so delaying baptism is a grave sin that jeopardizes the salvation of the child. Planning a party and waiting for family and godparents to get to town are not sufficient reasons to delay baptism. Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-506858903716169612016-02-03T19:07:19.757-05:002016-02-03T19:07:19.757-05:00Today, most mothers, I suspect, are gone from chur...Today, most mothers, I suspect, are gone from church for a very short time for the birth of a child - maybe only a few days. The post-partum "lying in" is, for better or for worse, long past.<br /><br />My own experience is that Baptisms are scheduled not "as soon as possible" but as soon as practicable. Grandparents, godparents, others must travel to the place where the Baptism is to be administered. It is rare in most cases, I would suggest, that the first return of a new mother to church after giving birth would coincide with the Baptism of the child.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-61874796495983814572016-02-03T12:29:18.805-05:002016-02-03T12:29:18.805-05:00Anonymous, there's no problem with that situat...Anonymous, there's no problem with that situation since the ritual is not imparting anything. The churching is still the "official" welcoming of the mother back into the church, but the symbolism is lessened by the fact that she's already been back.<br /><br />Generally, though, since the baptism takes place as soon as possible after the birth of the child (and the churching is done along with the baptism these days), the mother's first entrance back to the Church would be at the baptism of the child.Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-45470610211180174622016-02-03T11:52:52.743-05:002016-02-03T11:52:52.743-05:00If the mother has returned to church before the ce...If the mother has returned to church before the ceremonial "churching"...?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-12170653742153044852016-02-03T11:07:34.336-05:002016-02-03T11:07:34.336-05:00Anonymous, the label "churching" is very...Anonymous, the label "churching" is very ancient, so that it is why it is still used. It makes sense -- it is called "churching" because it is the first time the mother comes back to the Church after giving birth. Her first act upon being "churched" is one of thanksgiving. <br /><br />Both parents indeed give thanks, but the mother gives particular thanks since she is the one who did the labor of giving birth and undertook the risks associated therewith. Practically speaking, when my wife was "churched" a few months back, at the conclusion of the Rite, we both knelt at Our Lady's altar to make a thanksgiving and to consecrate our new child to the Immaculate Heart. <br /><br />As for the purification aspect of it, yesterday's feast is a good reminder that humbly submitting to a ceremony in accordance with the tradition is a good thing, even though we recognize that there is no ritual impurity associated with childbearing. I think the prayers of the Rite do not have an emphasis on impurity, but the idea of going to the Temple following childbirth has its genesis in that purification. But now the purpose is in accordance with our proper understanding of things in light of our tradition and faith.Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-90446051454211632702016-02-03T10:15:47.015-05:002016-02-03T10:15:47.015-05:00Thank you - that helps a great deal.
Should we th...Thank you - that helps a great deal.<br /><br />Should we then not call this "churching" but "thanksgiving"? It is, according to your source, "imitative" of the "purification" of the Old Covenant.<br /><br />Also, do not both parents give thanks? Why just the mother of the child?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-22572558702331096082016-02-03T09:41:50.035-05:002016-02-03T09:41:50.035-05:00I was afraid of that.
Talk about a disproportiona...I was afraid of that.<br /><br />Talk about a disproportionate response.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00554830859411216515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-23633632835953526082016-02-03T09:34:06.881-05:002016-02-03T09:34:06.881-05:00Anonymous, if you read the Rite of Churching, you ...Anonymous, if you read the Rite of Churching, you may gain some understanding of the purpose of it. Most particularly, you will find that the Rite has as its main aspect a thanksgiving to God for the gift of a child. Here is the principle prayer of the Rite:<br /><br />Almighty, everlasting God, through the delivery of the blessed Virgin Mary, Thou hast turned into joy the pains of the faithful in childbirth; look mercifully upon this Thy handmaid, coming in gladness to Thy temple to offer up her thanks: and grant that after this life, by the merits and intercession of the same blessed Mary, she may merit to arrive, together with her offspring, at the joys of everlasting happiness. Through Christ our Lord.<br /><br />The entire Rite can be read <a href="http://www.fisheaters.com/churchingofwomen.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-22819938158032722462016-02-03T08:43:13.476-05:002016-02-03T08:43:13.476-05:00Why would a woman need, after giving birth, to be ...Why would a woman need, after giving birth, to be "churched?". Has she done something to "un-church" her?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-62162967641420714012016-02-02T17:56:37.408-05:002016-02-02T17:56:37.408-05:00Flavius, nothing was deleted. He wrote that in res...Flavius, nothing was deleted. He wrote that in response to my 3:42 comment. Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-3479751535459335602016-02-02T17:54:27.250-05:002016-02-02T17:54:27.250-05:00If the Mass is the means by which Christ's sac...If the Mass is the means by which Christ's sacrifice, His one and only, is made present on our altars in an unbloody way as is His Most Holy Body and Blood, to denigrate a valid Mass celebrated as it is meant to be by the rubrics is off limits. I've had those who hate the EF Mass say the same thing about it and I can't stand hearing it from those who hate the OF Mass. It's the same sinful mentality but just in a different direction. You should know better!Fr. Allan J. McDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16986575955114152639noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-75351008134845850612016-02-02T16:57:45.335-05:002016-02-02T16:57:45.335-05:00What did he say??? Did it get deleted?
Estou con...What did he say??? Did it get deleted? <br /><br />Estou confundido.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00554830859411216515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-45752865251854418462016-02-02T16:18:07.268-05:002016-02-02T16:18:07.268-05:00Thank you, Father! You made my day! The Fathers of...Thank you, Father! You made my day! The Fathers of Mercy are wonderful!<br />Carol H.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02475843499648488542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-61585286527551913442016-02-02T16:15:35.038-05:002016-02-02T16:15:35.038-05:00Father, if I hadn't met you in person, I would...Father, if I hadn't met you in person, I would have a hard time believing that you are a real person with some of the ridiculous things you write on this blog.Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-10281668803328062102016-02-02T15:49:23.006-05:002016-02-02T15:49:23.006-05:00I hope you were taught in RCIA or eventually that ...I hope you were taught in RCIA or eventually that being cynical is a negative spirit emanating from the devil and when applied to the Official Liturgy of the Church, its ordinary form Pontifical Mass and celebrated by the Book (one of the two forms of the one Latin Rite) it appears to me to be blasphemy since is the the Holy Sacrifice in which Christ is made present in an unbloody way. I think for someone to say what you said about a beautiful papal liturgy celebrated according to the rubrics, the mind of Holy Mother Church and with dignity and care boarders on blasphemy of the Eucharist a sin reserved to the Holy See and during the year of mercy to the missionaries of mercy sent to various dioceses. Fr. Allan J. McDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16986575955114152639noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-28905146469102965892016-02-02T15:42:43.668-05:002016-02-02T15:42:43.668-05:00I don't watch videos of the pope's liturgy...I don't watch videos of the pope's liturgy. I do not attend the Novus Ordo in person, and I have no desire to watch it on the internet either.Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-13529755625849593192016-02-02T15:26:36.218-05:002016-02-02T15:26:36.218-05:00Given the catechesis of most US Catholics, they pr...Given the catechesis of most US Catholics, they probably believe that Groundhog Day is when Jesus came out of the tomb, saw His shadow, and went back in for six more weeks.Genehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06672484450736725268noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-12162638241333063682016-02-02T15:17:52.936-05:002016-02-02T15:17:52.936-05:00Carol H. our Lenten Mission is Sunday - Wednesday ...Carol H. our Lenten Mission is Sunday - Wednesday Feb 28 thru March 2. We'll have a Father of Mercy. <br /><br />Marc and Jacob, I bet you won't have as many as Pope Francis had for his blessing of candles and procession at St. Peter's this evening. Look at the video, beautiful vestments, everyone had candles, procession into darkened church--just beautiful. Fr. Allan J. McDonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16986575955114152639noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-83282989555759931752016-02-02T14:29:54.864-05:002016-02-02T14:29:54.864-05:00Sorry this is off subject, but will there be a pre...Sorry this is off subject, but will there be a pre-Lenten mission this year? I haven't seen any info yet.<br />Carol H.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02475843499648488542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-66294951900137269922016-02-02T13:32:18.063-05:002016-02-02T13:32:18.063-05:00Same here, Jacob. The mother is churched after th...Same here, Jacob. The mother is churched after the baptism and then the child is consecrated to the Immaculate Heart.<br /><br />At our usual parish (FSSP), there are three Masses every Sunday and all are standing room only. If you want to attend a feast day Mass in the evening, you have to get there pretty early to get a seat. Tonight, we'll go to the Institute of Christ the King parish in hopes that there'll be more seating available (and it's closer to my work than the FSSP).Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-19275168071951387022016-02-02T12:45:07.120-05:002016-02-02T12:45:07.120-05:00Marc is so right. At my traditional parish we have...Marc is so right. At my traditional parish we have so many new young married couples that we are constantly baptizing babies. If the mother attends the baptism she is churched right after the baptism. I too will be at candlemas tonite for the blessing and procession. Something we are seeing is a big influx of new parishioners this past year along with many people visiting. We have always been growing but its now a very large increase, masses are standing room only. Jacobnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7846189835239594160.post-77910886282097115422016-02-02T10:08:38.825-05:002016-02-02T10:08:38.825-05:00I'll be at the procession and Missa Cantata fo...I'll be at the procession and Missa Cantata for Candlemas this evening, thanks be to God! This is one of my favorite feasts of the Church year.<br /><br />Although this article speaks of the Churching of Women as something from the past, this ritual still takes place in traditional Roman Catholic parishes. Marchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13510317669833026685noreply@blogger.com